Nogueira blames self for loss

[trip]

Re: Nogueira blames self for loss

i watched most the the ultimate figher between mir and noguira

imho, Mir, finally listened to Mir

ie, he had a game plan, and he trained for that game plan, which if you watched he was so disgusted by how many of his fighters would not listen to simple directions

anyways, this is what mire said fifty times on the show

"Ya gotta attack in 1-2-3 mode, you have to."

ie, every attack has a first move, that leads too a second move, and then a finish off move

when u rewatch the fight, you will see he had 2-3 combo's down cold that he used a half dozen times and a few others he threw in too mix it up

my guess is that is how he trained, what he spent his time on, perfecting ten combinations, 3 go to's, 3 good ones he had faith in, and 4 others he has not perfected yet, but is working on, that might be of use if his handlers see something

noguira, fwiw, looked slow, and mir looked fast

we've all been there had those days, where we are on or off, and when the homework and prep has been done, and opportunity meets time

hats off too mir, i like the guy and think he is a very good announcer

[FUZO]

Re: Nogueira blames self for loss

agree 100% not to mention nog should have fought randy not lesnar.

they need to split the HW division. a 220# guy fighting a 280# guy (brock cuts to meet the 265# max) is not a fair fight in which skill is the key factor and not just size and strength

205# - 240# and 240# - up

its just like uriah faber fighting rampage its stupid

What about all the big guys randy fought before and beat there ass. Are we saying randy is just a old fart now and washed up

[FUZO]

Re: Nogueira blames self for loss

like the guy and think he is a very good announcer

OMG WE AGREE ON SOMETHING AND THATS ALL HE'S GOOD AT

[FUZO]

Re: Nogueira blames self for loss

Brock's standup is by no means better than Mir's. Brock has reach and punches straight down the pipe, but to say that his standup is better than Mir's is just ridiculous in my mind. Mir's has better head movement, more than one type of punch, kicks, muay thai clinch, karate, etc... Brock's biggest strength in his stand up is his reach and that is it. Nog looked like shit because Mir was so much better. Nog looked worse than usual, but he didn't look that much off what he usually is. Nog would have looked alot better if he had fought someone less talented. Nog said himself that he Mir came out better than he thought he would.

Oh and Brock did put Mir on his ass....which put Brock in Mir's world....which in turn put Brock in a heel hook and lost the fight. So, if you think about it....if Brock's standup is so much better, he should have just stayed up instead of jumping down on top of a black belt in BJJ.

And I hate to break it to you man, but Brock is the champ because he fought a much smaller 50 year old man. I mean come one...the guy got the belt before Mir got a shot and Mir beat him in his last fight...how dumb is that? Mir beat him 2 fights ago and now he has to beat him again for the belt, come on.

LETS REMEMBER MIR HAS BEEN OUT OF ACTION SINCE HIS ACCIDENT AND REALLY HASNT FOUGHT ANYONE WITH CONTENDER VALUE IMO BUT IF HE HAS I HAVENT BEEN KEEPING A UPDATE ON MIR AND HE ALMOST LOST TO BROCK. A INSHAPE NOG WINS HANDS DOWN AGAINST MIR

Nog looked like shit because Mir was so much better

OH CMON DUDE EVERYONE EVEN SAID IT THAT NOG DIDNT LOOK LIKE HIMSELF HE EVEN SAID IT.

Brock's biggest strength in his stand up is his reach and that is it

DUDE YOU FORGET HIS MASSIVE POWER AND STRENGTH

Oh and Brock did put Mir on his ass....which put Brock in Mir's world....which in turn put Brock in a heel hook and lost the fight. So, if you think about it....if Brock's standup is so much better, he should have just stayed up instead of jumping down on top of a black belt in BJJ.

WHAT WAS THIS BROCKS 2ND FIGHT SINCE JOINING THE MMA WORLD BIG ROOKIE MISTAKE HE MADE THATS ALL.

And I hate to break it to you man, but Brock is the champ because he fought a much smaller 50 year old man. I mean come one...the guy got the belt before Mir got a shot and Mir beat him in his last fight...how dumb is that? Mir beat him 2 fights ago and now he has to beat him again for the belt, come on.

[/QUOTE]

I LOVE IT WHEN RANDY LOSES NOW ITS BECAUSE HE'S OLD BUT WHEN HE WINS ITS HIS TALENT OF MMA AND SKILL.

FROM TOTALY READING THIS IT SEEMS YOU HATE BROCK WHICH IS FINE AND I'M NOT A MIR FAN BUT TO SAY ALL THOSE THINGS IS FUNNY. BROCK HAS THE ABILITY TO BE A GREAT HW CHAMP AND HE'S ON HIS WAY.YOU SAY MIR IS GETTING BETTER WELL SO IS BROCK EVERY DAY

the guy got the belt before Mir got a shot and Mir beat him in his last fight...how dumb is that? Mir beat him 2 fights ago and now he has to beat him again for the belt, come on

TALK TO DANA ABOUT TITLE FIGHTS AND AGAIN BROCK MADE A ROOKIE MISTAKE AND HERES THE TRUTH THE REF SHOULD OF NEVER STOPPED THE FIGHT NO FUKIN WAY IVE WATCHED AS YOU HAVE THAT OTHER FIGHTERS HAVE HIT HARDER BEHIND THE HEAD AS BROCK DID AND THE REFS NEVER STOPPED THOSE OTHER FIGHTS AND YOU KNOW THAT TO BE A FACT.

[tn94z]

Re: Nogueira blames self for loss

LETS REMEMBER MIR HAS BEEN OUT OF ACTION SINCE HIS ACCIDENT AND REALLY HASNT FOUGHT ANYONE WITH CONTENDER VALUE IMO BUT IF HE HAS I HAVENT BEEN KEEPING A UPDATE ON MIR AND HE ALMOST LOST TO BROCK. A INSHAPE NOG WINS HANDS DOWN AGAINST MIR

Mir has a record of 4-2 since his accident:

Marcio Cruz-L- First fight back after wreck
Dan Christison-W
Brandon Vera-L
Antoni Hardonk-W
Brock Lesnar-W
Nog-W

OH CMON DUDE EVERYONE EVEN SAID IT THAT NOG DIDNT LOOK LIKE HIMSELF HE EVEN SAID IT.

No it didn't, but if you look at the rest of his fights, he was getting his ass kicked in the majority of them until he catches them in a submission. This is no different that what happened in the Lesnar/Mir fight.

DUDE YOU FORGET HIS MASSIVE POWER AND STRENGTH

I didn't forget about this. You said he had better stand up. He doesn't have near the standup that Mir does. There is more to standup than power and strength.

WHAT WAS THIS BROCKS 2ND FIGHT SINCE JOINING THE MMA WORLD BIG ROOKIE MISTAKE HE MADE THATS ALL.

Brock is actually 3-1. He has beat Min Soo Kim, Herring, and Couture with a loss to Mir. So all of the sudden since he beat Couture he is not a rookie? He didn't make a rookie mistake against Mir. He did what he should have done in that situation. He just wasn't good enough to not get sub'd by Mir. It wasn't a rookie mistake by Lesnar. It was just a very good heel hook by a black belt in BJJ. There was nothing that Lesnar did wrong...he just got beat. And to say that he almost beat Mir..that is a matter of opinion. Fights go like this all of the time. There are plenty of fights where a fighter is getting beat and he pulls off a KO or sub. That doesn't mean that he almost got beat.

I LOVE IT WHEN RANDY LOSES NOW ITS BECAUSE HE'S OLD BUT WHEN HE WINS ITS HIS TALENT OF MMA AND SKILL.

That's because he hasn't lost his last few fights and he has gotten older since his last fight before Brock. Give me a break man. Brock had probably 60lbs on Couture at that fight. That is alot to over come. I can almost guarantee if that fight happens again, Randy hands Brock his ass.

FROM TOTALY READING THIS IT SEEMS YOU HATE BROCK WHICH IS FINE AND I'M NOT A MIR FAN BUT TO SAY ALL THOSE THINGS IS FUNNY. BROCK HAS THE ABILITY TO BE A GREAT HW CHAMP AND HE'S ON HIS WAY.YOU SAY MIR IS GETTING BETTER WELL SO IS BROCK EVERY DAY

Honestly, I didn't like Brock when he first came on the scene because I think his name got him moved up the ladder faster than most. I actually like Brock now because he has settled into MMA and I can see that he has the talent to be one of the best. Mir is getting better and so is Brock, but Mir has been doing this his whole life. There is nothing Brock can do to make up for the 15 or so years he missed while Mir was training in MMA.

TALK TO DANA ABOUT TITLE FIGHTS AND AGAIN BROCK MADE A ROOKIE MISTAKE AND HERES THE TRUTH THE REF SHOULD OF NEVER STOPPED THE FIGHT NO FUKIN WAY IVE WATCHED AS YOU HAVE THAT OTHER FIGHTERS HAVE HIT HARDER BEHIND THE HEAD AS BROCK DID AND THE REFS NEVER STOPPED THOSE OTHER FIGHTS AND YOU KNOW THAT TO BE A FACT.

Dana doesn't make the fights. Joe Silva does. Getting caught in a heel hook by one of the best HW BJJ practicioners in the world is not a rookie mistake...it is just being beat. The "rookie mistake" thing is an excuse for Brock fans to justify the loss of the "next best thing."


Here is the thing. I like Brock and I'm not saying that he hasn't earned his wins because he has. But there is no reason that anyone has any good reason to discredit Mir's win over Nog. Nog may not have been himself but he would not have come into that fight if he did not think he would beat Mir...especially in a title fight. So the whole, "Nog was himself" is a way of discrediting Mir's win and I think that is Bull****.

And as far as Randy goes, yeah he has skills and he has experience, but he has never been known for his standup or BJJ game. Mir has the skills and size that Randy is lacking. Randy's biggest attribute is his ability to come up with a gameplan to counteract his opponent. He is the best in the business at that. And yes I do think age and size comes into play in any fight that Randy is in. That is what makes his wins get crowned with the "great skill and mma ability" because he wins these fights at an age when he should not be doing it. But when he loses, then of course the age factor is going to be brought into it. There is only so many beatings that a body can take. I am not trying to discredit Brock in any way, but if you want to discredit Mir's win then I can definately make a better argument against Brock.

[FUZO]

Re: Nogueira blames self for loss

QUOTE]That doesn't mean that he almost got beat.[/QUOTE]

tn94z if that dumb ass ref doesnt handle the fight like he did by stoppping it to take away a point from brock was just awful.a ton of other fighters have hit in the back of the head and have got way more warnings then brock did and there fights werent stopped to take a point away. . the ref doesnt step in mir loses.A high profile fight for a ref to do this was stupid.Brock was going off on mir so the ref should of called the fight and raised brocks hand in victory.

[BIGMOFO]

Re: Nogueira blames self for loss

BROCK AND MIR WILL BE A HELL OF A FIGHT I THINK...IM READY FOR IT!

[tn94z]

Re: Nogueira blames self for loss

QUOTE]That doesn't mean that he almost got beat.

tn94z if that dumb ass ref doesnt handle the fight like he did by stoppping it to take away a point from brock was just awful.a ton of other fighters have hit in the back of the head and have got way more warnings then brock did and there fights werent stopped to take a point away. . the ref doesnt step in mir loses.A high profile fight for a ref to do this was stupid.Brock was going off on mir so the ref should of called the fight and raised brocks hand in victory.[/QUOTE]

The red warned him several times and Brock kept doing it...what more can the ref do? The whole thing is that Mir was intelligently defending himself and ref's don't stop fights when that is happening. Once a fighter stops intelligently defending himself is when the fight gets stopped. I would think that with you being a Brock fan, you would be happy that Mir won and gets to fight Brock again. Unless you are afraid that Mir will beat him....again!

Fuzo, we could probably go on and on about this topic. The bottom line is that Brock holds the belt and Mir won the interim title. Let's just all be happy that they get to fight again and settle any doubts in anyone's mind. I think we can both agree that the rematch will be a GOOD one.

Man this turned out to be a very interesting thread.

[BIGSARGE]

Re: Nogueira blames self for loss

IF IT GOES PAST THE FIRST ROUND MIR HAS IT FOR SURE. BROCK WAS SO GASSED AGAINST RANDY HE WAS BARELY STANDING. HE WASNT DOING ANYTHING TO RANDY UNTIL HE CAUGHT HIM AND HE OUTWEIGHED HIM BY 60LBS. MIR ISNT THE SAME FIGHTER WHO FAUGHT BROCK THE FIRST TIME EITHER. HIS FIGHT AGAINST BROCK WAS WIN OR YOUR OUT OF THE UFC. HIS CONFIDENCE IS BACK WHERE IT USED TO BE NOW AND I DONT THING THERE WILL BE ANY STOPPING HIM.

[tn94z]

Re: Nogueira blames self for loss

IF IT GOES PAST THE FIRST ROUND MIR HAS IT FOR SURE. BROCK WAS SO GASSED AGAINST RANDY HE WAS BARELY STANDING. HE WASNT DOING ANYTHING TO RANDY UNTIL HE CAUGHT HIM AND HE OUTWEIGHED HIM BY 60LBS. MIR ISNT THE SAME FIGHTER WHO FAUGHT BROCK THE FIRST TIME EITHER. HIS FIGHT AGAINST BROCK WAS WIN OR YOUR OUT OF THE UFC. HIS CONFIDENCE IS BACK WHERE IT USED TO BE NOW AND I DONT THING THERE WILL BE ANY STOPPING HIM.

My thoughts exactly. I didn't want to bring up the cardio thing because Mir's cardio was so bad in the past. A confident and more advanced Mir is scary IMO.

[FUZO]

Re: Nogueira blames self for loss

BROCK WAS SO GASSED AGAINST RANDY HE WAS BARELY STANDING

but brock sure did knock out randy being gassed and all and couldnt stand. And a more confident brock with more knowledge and skill is a very dangerous brock. so when brock fights mir again he will be even better just as you all say mir will be. Theres a post o2 made that people still look at brock as a wwf wrestler and think he's a joke but he has showed he is no joke.

[tn94z]

Re: Nogueira blames self for loss

I don't think he is a joke. He has come into his own in MMA. I just don't think he is as good as Mir. I just think his size and speed will win his fights more than his skill will.

[FUZO]

Re: Nogueira blames self for loss

I just don't think he is as good as Mir

not in the martial arts bjj stuff brock isnt as good as mir because of just now getting into the sport but learning.Put brock with a black belt say in bjj or something he kills the competition imo.

I just think his size and speed will win his fights more than his skill will.

Brock is gifted for being that fast,quick, speed with his build. just give him some more time and he will develope into a very dangerous person in hw class

[O2BESOHUGE]

Re: Nogueira blames self for loss

BROCK IS NO JOKE THATS FOR SURE. HE HAS THE ABILITY TO DO WHATEVER HE WANTS IN THIS SPORT IF HE GETS WITH THE RIGHT TRAINERS. I AGREE HES NEW, BUT WITH HIS ATHLETICISM, HE WILL LEARN QUICKLY. HIS SIZE AND STRENGTH WILL BE A BIG PLUS TO HIM AS A HEAVYWEIGHT. HES BIGGER, FASTER, QUICKER AND STRONGER THAN ANY OTHER HEAVYWEIGHT IN THE UFC RIGHT NOW.

I WISH I COULD HAVE SEEN BROCK DEMOLISH TIM SILVIA IN A FIGHT! THATS ONE HEAVYWEIGHT THATS LESS DESERVING TO BE THERE THAN BROCK IMO.

AND ITS LIKE EVERYONE KEEPS SAYING...THEY STILL THINK OF HIM AS A WWE WRESTLER. HES SAID THE WHOLE TIME, HE WASNT INTO THE "STAGED" WRESTLING THING. THATS WHY HE GOT OUT.

[tn94z]

Re: Nogueira blames self for loss

not in the martial arts bjj stuff brock isnt as good as mir because of just now getting into the sport but learning.Put brock with a black belt say in bjj or something he kills the competition imo.



Brock is gifted for being that fast,quick, speed with his build. just give him some more time and he will develope into a very dangerous person in hw class

I don't care who Brock gets with to train in BJJ, it will never ever ever be at the level of Mir. There is no way on earth that Brock can make up for the 10-15 years of BJJ experience that Mir has. There is alot more to BJJ than learning subs on a mat in the training room.


I agree with you 100% that he will be a very very dangerous HW in the future. I am just arguing the point that Brock is not as good as Mir and that his size and quickness will be the determining factor in the majority of his fights...not his skill.