UH-OH

[trip]

Re: UH-OH

He's written his own speeches.

Well bush was my governor, did not a damned thing, if u go back and look at his interviews during his run for president in hindsight all of the information was there clear as a bell what how he would perform.

If it was so easy, leadership training then people would be phenomenal. Most folks are not disciplined enough to follow simple directions consistently, most don't have the patience, cause most don't want the responsibility.

Just cause he does not have the track record u desire, does not mean others evaluation is incorrect wrong or ignorant.

mc cain, part of the bush guys, increased government and doubled spending, got us into a war, and disregarded law, i'm sorry i cannot vote for a continuation of that, that's letting an alchoholic run a bar, not a good idea in my mind, now if the alhcholic had been sober and going to meeting for a decade i wouldn't mind, they need to rebuild trust, at least with me

[trip]

Re: UH-OH

yes, i'd vote for obama


no. 1 like t said he will only get a smidgen of what he talks about done

my sense, my best guess is that he will run stuff like he ran his campaign, not alot of talk, action u don't see, yet, when u see the results u know they worked hard too work on the right strategy, execute it etc.

alot of problems go back to total disregard and lack of oversight, which comes from the top

right now they all are like oh me oh my sub-prime problems, duh, all it takes is a napkin and a half a dozen numbers and five minutes of number crunching to know , and the acknolwegement that the 1,0000's of email u got for 100% financing no credit checks would end in disaster, and what did we do, no oversight

my gut with obama, basically says it is worth the gamble, imho, most people that are with him think in there heart of hearts if i had been president over the last 8 years i could have not messed it up as bad as bush, cause i sure as heck wouldn't went to war

[horsepwr]

Re: UH-OH

Nobody is forcing free trade and capitalism. It is just happening like you said trip.
I'm not all for the so called "laws of freedom" and rules of engagement. It didn't work out for our best interest for decades. Our safety went to shyt, and we got attacked several times over the last 20yrs. We haven't been attacked once on our own soil since G.W. Bush broke these wonderful rules that weren't doing shyt for our security. See, I am all for the elimination of Islamic fascism. That has proven to be our biggest problem, and those crazy fukers are experiencing absolute defeat. The problem is being solved. The peaceful movement is spreading like wild fire among them. What more could we ask for with that situation. It is definitely a situation that had to be dealt with, and everybody with some common sense agrees on that. We can't all agree on how it should've been dealt with, but anybody that denies that we are conquering now is either way off base with reality or in a serious state of denial.

[trip]

Re: UH-OH

how many:

islamic facists are there

how many terrorist are there

how many al quida are there

and where are they located


fwiw, after 9-11 we had a consensus thru out the world to hunt down obam alquida and anihilate them

what did we do, came up with an axis of evil, and invaded iraq, for 40 years we had 15000 nukes pointed at us, and we survived, one maybe and we go too war, that is no different than sayin, oh me oh my horsepower has access to a gun, guns kill people, thus we must invade horsepowers house to prevent him from killing people, even though he has done nothing wrong

that is why we lost the worlds trust


i don't understand you're "laws of freedom" and rules of engagement issue

i've posted before of idiocy of peace dividend, and the fact good old obama was nice enough to write us a letter and declare war on us and what did clinton do, nothing

if a society believes religion and government should be one in the same, there is not much we can do, that is the other side of freedom

statistically about 1,000 things had to go right for those guys, once it was done, you had 3-4 billion folks with there eyes open, not being attched on our soil, is the same as nimby, not in my back yard, that pisses folks off, yell i'll go blow up somone elses country cause i don't want them in mine, uh, even though that is against the law

i got no problem though with running thru afganistan or pakistan to hunt them down, we should have followed thru on that, an action that unequivocably proves something, versus stupidity of iraq

[horsepwr]

Re: UH-OH

Well we can believe whatever we want, but I believe that the hunt for Osama is still very much alive, I don't think the weekly updates on the status of the hunt is just for shyts and giggles. I don't think they're bustin al-queida ass after ass by chance.

Was it entirely the consensus of WMD in Iraq, or was a major reason for invasion the fact of overthrowing the dictatorship that was currently in power and rooting out terrorist?.. Both??? all of the above??? Then there's that statement, "terrorist weren't there until we invaded."...yeah....well, let me be selfish and say that at least they're over there and "not in my back yard",lol...that ideology was birthed over there so...sorry folks, but it needs to be ended right where it started.
Now, there's a big difference between 'oh me oh my, trip has a gun. guns kill people. We better go invade trips domain even though trip has done nothing." And.."oh me oh my, trip has guns. trip has murdered by the masses and so on and so on. He's acting like he's got some major shyt right now. Should we go in and prevent another mass extermination, or wait and see what happens?" I'm for taking action. The world is getting smaller and smaller. Ideology, as you stated, can spread from one continent to another in a split second. There is indeed a proven change of the al-quieda movement for the better...for the free world's benefit from the recent war. This is a good thing.

[trip]

Re: UH-OH

well, if truth be told, imho, they went in there because they want to have control of the middle east, they want free reign that they control in the middle of it all

no different than putting a cop station in the middle of high crime area

i understand he was a mass murdered, i had no problem with inspections, i just believe we should have sanctioned them out, which again, the world was pretty much agreed upon, restraint has advantages imho


agree the world is smaller and smaller

i don't understand going to war, when we don't know how many, where are they at, etc. etc.

i never said the hunt wasn't alive, imho, it should have been the priority

the life span of cults who's primary objective is to kill others is short, because there are only so many nut jobs in the world, that are stable enough to hide there nut job ness

my whole point on this one is while this is an unfortuante situation it is not anything new in the history of the world, the over reaction and fear, imho, are unwarranted, i'm not saying ignore, i'm just saying that imho i feel they have an obsession, and most are not good because it leads too bad decisions, and one bad decision always leads too two others

on another note, i think we've beaten this subject into the ground, it was a good discussion

if you want me to answer anything i will

have a good weekend

[horsepwr]

Re: UH-OH

good discussion indeed trip. I appreciate the points.

[pigmeat]

Re: UH-OH

my oh my, where is djdiggler when we need him,lol

[horsepwr]

Re: UH-OH

my oh my is right. please don't jenx a good thing,lol...I don't think us lemmings can even relate to his sheer genius.

[Klash]

Re: UH-OH

who under 50 hasn't done drugs, and bunches of them

Yeah but most politicians will be asked about these kinds of issues at length for weeks. For Obama it barely registered on the media radar and the interest in Marxism; which I find extremely relevant, even less than the drugs.

First off, i think dems have a huge problem, for some reason they believe no one is allowed to experience pain. Most of what they propose is too alleviate someones pain usually at the expense of someone else's work.

Yes, this is their basic philosophical beliefs, individual sacrifice for the good of the collective. Obama's interest in Marxism in his younger years would only confirm this belief. His voting record on less controversial issues displays he is a typical liberal and reconfirms this belief but when it comes to how deep his liberal beliefs go, we are blind because he abstains from the more controversial votes. Which I think would be relevant, before people offer him their vote.

It takes more effort for Obama to maintain the amount of vagueness and generalities he does than to express his specific beliefs - the reason he isn't is because once he moves to ideas some of his supporters will step back from him. I understand that most politicians are like this but most will be pressured at some point to explain themselves - he hasn't. As a matter of fact, I saw Chris Matthews talking about how Obama's speech gave him a tingle up his leg! Maybe Matthews can be Obama's Lewinsky!

Here in usa with freedom of speech we can challenge em, and challenge em hard.

If he becomes president, his goal like david believes leadership is key, is to find the best people, get the best idea's work across ailes and implement the best ones.
When u find the best idea's it is easier to implement them cause everyone believes in the consensus.

Compromising opposing ideas does not lead to the implementation of the best ideas and consensus does not lead to finding the best ideas.

Your phrases "best people" and "best ideas" are pretty relative standards to just take on face value. I'm sure most the candidates will find who they determine to be the best people with the best ideas. The difference between the candidates is how they define "best" and best for whom; the so called "collective" or the individual?

[Klash]

Re: UH-OH

klash...should it come down to mccain and obama, who would you go with? (very likely will) i know who they pick for a running mate helps in the decission making proccess, but i was just wondering. you too horse.
for me...i, honestly, dont even know that i'll vote. it'll be the first time in my adult life that i didnt, but i'm not liking either really

I'm with you. I will not vote for either one of those guys. If ron paul runs as a third party, I'll vote for him, I'll probably do a write in if he doesn't. Of course Bloomberg might run as an independent. He might be more conservative than the two we will have; I don't know much about him though.

[horsepwr]

Re: UH-OH

I'm with you. I will not vote for either one of those guys. If ron paul runs as a third party, I'll vote for him, I'll probably do a write in if he doesn't. Of course Bloomberg might run as an independent. He might be more conservative than the two we will have; I don't know much about him though.

Of coarse I'll be voting Ron Paul if he's on the ballot. I've been meaning to learn up on Bloomberg though. He needs to get with the program if he's going to. He might just be our savior. But realistically, it is the perfect storm for a democrat this election. We're probably going to be giving it up to Obama.

[daved150]

Re: UH-OH

Your phrases "best people" and "best ideas" are pretty relative standards to just take on face value. I'm sure most the candidates will find who they determine to be the best people with the best ideas. The difference between the candidates is how they define "best" and best for whom; the so called "collective" or the individual?

thats completly correct, imo. it's his (the ceo, manager, pres.) to decide who is "the best" for the job. you hope to hire a man, (that ceo,manager, pres), that will make that decission on whats best for the house....who's the guy that best compensates for a short coming he has in another area. not who do i owe a favor too, and not necc., who thinks like me. one of my the best assistants that i had was almost the oppisit of me. in the car biz, i'm all about gross proffit. he's all about number of units sold. combined, we raised gross proffits and number of units sold quater after quater. it was a surprise to everyone that i promoted him. we really never socialized other than at work, and i would always take jabs at him for being weak in gross. but, he had a talent i needed....he raised the unit numbers, i raised the gross.
my boss said he wanst surprised that i bumped him up. he said, he thaught when he hired me, i'd do the right thing, to get things moving in the right dirrection, regardless of freindships.
there's noway of knowing if any of these guy's will lead in a way simaler. i dont even know if most people take any of that into account. i still say, that is G.B. biggest prob. and the root of ALL his prob's. poor managment. now, i dont KNOW that r. paul, will lead like that, but from listening to the man, it dont seem like he's affraid to face prob's. even if they fly in the face of "conventional" thinking, and based on that, and other things he's said, i feel he would do his best for us and not so much for any "sponcers", like the other have, would, and will do!

[T-Man007]

Re: UH-OH

i agree with you t...100%. i really dont know that i'll be particapating...maybe i'll write in Montey Brewster!

LOL! It woudl be funny...and sad...if someone like Mickey Mouse got a fair share of votes this time around with the clowns we have to pick from. Look, I'm sorry if any of you guys like any of these people, but my personal opinion is they all suck.

[T-Man007]

Re: UH-OH

my oh my, where is djdiggler when we need him,lol

LOL! He's riding his bike to work because of gas prices, so he doesn't get home until real late. LOL