Need direction...

[ripped2shreds]

Hi,

I've spent half the day reading posts here, as the noob instructions recommeded. Needless to say, its a little above my head. I'm teetering on the edge of a decision here and I need some advice from the well experienced.

As you can tell, this is my first post, so take my ignorance with a grain of salt. I've never used A.S., but I have often kicked the idea around. I've seen first hand what they can do, and its amazing. I've also heard horror stories about the side effects. I believe that some or most of these may be the result of misuse or overuse, but I can't say for sure. I figure you guys would give it to me straight.

I'm 30 years old, and have been the same size since I was 17 (eat your heart out beer drinkers). While that may seem appealing to the fitness challenged, its very bad for me. I've never been able to add weight of any kind, in any resonable amount of time. 6'3" tall and only 173lbs. Strength increases but, mass just won't come. Definition - not a problem (hence my user ID). Tried the weight gainers, finally got past the taste, but still cannot get results, not to mention the sheer amount of shakes has me ready to swear off chocolate.

I feel my answer is here, somehow always knew it was. I know absolutely nothing about procedure, cycles, hell I can only name about 2 substances. I need someone to take the info I've given and try to extrapolate a plan. I cannot stress this enough, you need to be as specific as possible as I will follow instructions explicitly, for fear of screwing someting up if I don't. Just to be clear, mass is the goal, strength and definition have never been a problem for me.

Thanks in advance, I know many of you will help all you can.

[shyster]

how many calories are you eating daily? at 6'3" and 173 pounds i'd imagine you are not eating near enough, it's just not possible. you have soooo much room to grow naturally. how long have you been working out consistently? and how much protein do you get daily? i think the problem lies somewhere in there, b/c i have yet to meet a thin guy that says he can't gain weight that can't once he gets his exercise/diet in check. get those calories up to around 3500-4000 and the pounds will come for sure. and i don't mean from pop-tarts and gummy bears. i mean from whole foods such as chicked breast, steak, vegetables and whole grain breads. try that and you'll be very surprised on what you can accomplish

[ripped2shreds]

Wow, thanks for the replies....

I've never been one to count calories...maybe that is the problem...I eat when I get hungry and stop when I am full. I eat what I can only describe as home-cookin. Lots of cube-steak, buscuits, gravy, mashed potatos...things that make normal people blow up like balloons! It has to be well within the calorie range you are describing if not above it, I suppose it could be overactive metabolism or something, I can't explain it. My weight has been within 5 pounds of 173 since 17 (and that only fluctuates when I get on the toilet, haha). I have been lifting again for about 9 months and have added maybe 2-3 solid pounds since then, I feel like that is well under my potential...

Oh yeah, in addition to all the food, I try to squeeze in the weight gainer 2200, but can only manage to get it about half a serving per day.

[shyster]

biscuits, gravy, and mashed potatoes are NOT helping you. they are carby junk. unless it's protein gravy, and whole grain protein biscuits, it's no good. i don't mean you can't cheat, b/c you are trying to bulk, but it sounds like you need more whole foods like i described. those weight gainers are great and all, but nothing is like a big chicken breast, piece of salmon, or a nice steak. liquid diet supplements only aid you in your goals, but they cannot be your sole source for what you are taking in, and so far the only thing i've seen that you eat that you have to chew is cube steak and biscuits. do some research in the recipe/food forum, it think that'll help you way more than any steroid, b/c steroids won't do ANYTHING if you don't consume what your body needs to grow. steroids are no magic solution. you have to factor in all the variables first, thes consider AS's

[mcbvr6]

Start counting calories, start eating every 3 hours, start eating quality foods (red meat, fish, chicken, oatmeal, whole wheat pasta and bread, flax oil, etc.). Once you have this down, where you are eating 3500 calories and 250 - 300 grams of protein per day, then you will be ready to move on.

As mass is your goal, look at drugs like dianabol, testosterone (probably cypionate or enanthate), deca and equipoise. You will hear several different theories about how much of each to take, and that is where you need to make decisions that no one else can make for you. You will hear people say a good beginner stack is 400-500 mgs per week for 10 weeks of testosterone and either deca or equipoise, maybe with dianabol thrown in for the first 4-5 weeks at 30-50 mgs per day. Others will say go higher and others will say go lower. You need to research what is right for you.

[shyster]

i'd hold off on the EQ if you are bulking. it's more for vascularity with minimal gains. but like he said, deca and test is a great combo for a first cycle. but really, it'd be best for you to learn to eat properly to gain and then worry about juice.

[ripped2shreds]

Thanks again...

Saturn...if you don't mind, what is enan?

Shyster...I do eat lots of beans, pinto beans. I understand these to be an excellent source of protein. Maybe its a different kind of protein from meats, and I need to switch. I still think my diet has to be enough to cover the requirements you set forth. The weight gainers are mostly carbs, with a little protein mixed in. Science tells me that your body can take anyting you eat, and turn it into any type of tissue in the body. Sure, it may be lots easier for the body to make new muscle out of protein, but it can be done with carbs, or even fat, just with more chemical steps involved. Anyway, what I want to do is break the monotony. Workouts are no fun anymore when the results don't come. It cannot be food alone...I've got to try something, or I'll never be able to dismiss the possibilities...

[shyster]

bro, sit down and eat a bucket of lard. go on, try it. let me know if your body converts it to protein and if you get big muscles from it. maybe what i've been doing for the past 10 years is all wrong and i should switch to your gravy diet, since it is working so well for you. with that said, please understand that everyone on here will tell what the above posts say, b/c it is tried and true. and if you don't know what enan is, you definately are not ready for AS's. i'll give you this one, but you need to do some research in the FAQ forum. Enan is Testosterone Enanthate

[mcbvr6]

enan means enanthate (its testosterone with a long acting ester in it - very similar to cypionate).

shyster, I politely disagree. Equipoise is not just for vascularity. The vascularity is a by-product of the increase in red blood cells. Eq. is as good as deca for bulking, you just won't gain as much water-weight, which I don't want anyway.

r2s - the idea here is to maximize your bodys ability to make new muscle. You want to make it as easy as possible. I wouldn't care if my body "could" make muscle from tree bark - if that is not the most efficient thing to eat, why bother.

You said before that you eat when you are hungry, at that point your body has already gone catabolic - its too late. Eat 600 calorie meals six times per day, spaced about 3 hours apart. As you get bigger you will need to either up the calories or add more meals.

I'm not saying don't do steroids, just trying to say get the diet down before you do and you will be a lot happier with the gains.

[shyster]

mcbvr6, i can't say EQ doesn't work for you, but for me a quite a few others on this board, it doesn't do too much for muscle mass. I do agree about the deca and water weight though, b/c it does blow me up, but nothing a little liquidex can't help

[mcbvr6]

Fair enough. Everyone reacts slightly differently to different gear it seems. When I first tried eq. I thought it was a waste. I was taking it at 400 mgs per week. After a while I tried it again on the advice of some guys like Lewd but at a much higher dose. At 800 - 1000 mgs it did pretty amazing things for me. Plus at that dose it made me eat all the time, which obviously helped out.

Try it again sometime at 800 mgs or more and see what you think. I bet you will like it.

[shyster]

hmmmm, maybe. i ran is at 600mg with 750mg of sust which i did get good gains, but i think was b/c of the test b/c i've got equal gains from running 750mg of sust by itself

[ripped2shreds]

mcbvr6...that makes perfect sense...

I didn't mean to imply that junk food was a good mucle builder...just that the body is an amazing cehmical factory, that can take jst about any edible substance, and trun it into whatever you need at that point.

Moving on...eating beofre you're hungy...what a novel idea... that may just be the step I am skipping...I have friends that play collegiate football who've said they set their alarm clocks to get up in the middle of the night and eat chick-fil-a sandwiches. I could never take it to that extreme, but I do see that some changes need to be made.

I respect your opinion that I am not ready to embrace AS, but I do want learn. And who better to recommend a beginners 'cycle' than you guys. I'm hearing test and deca (i happen to know what both of those are, remarkably). Is that the consensus among experts?

[shyster]

yeah that sounds good. enanthate is a test. there is enanthate, cypionate, suspension, prop, and sustanon (blend of all 4). if you are going to do it anyway, i don't wanna see you hurt yourself so i'll recomend something for you. i'd go with test (preferably cyp, enan, or sust b/c prop and suspension has to be injected every day or every other day) @ 500mg/weekly for 10 weeks and deca @ 400mg/week also for 10 weeks. don't forget anti-e's and clomid. you can find out about that for yourself (we can't just give you everything on a platter). do a search for clomid in the FAQ forum. hope all goes well

[ripped2shreds]

OK, on the right track now...just went to O'Charleys for luch and ate steak AND chicken breast. It was a struggle to get it all down, but I suppose I'll have to get used to it. Thanks for the help bros, I'll post new questions later...