A new country???

[kite]

TweetLakota Indians Withdraw Treaties Signed With U.S. 150 Years Ago
Thursday , December 20, 2007

WASHINGTON —

The Lakota Indians, who gave the world legendary warriors Sitting Bull and Crazy Horse, have withdrawn from treaties with the United States.

"We are no longer citizens of the United States of America and all those who live in the five-state area that encompasses our country are free to join us,'' long-time Indian rights activist Russell Means said.

A delegation of Lakota leaders has delivered a message to the State Department, and said they were unilaterally withdrawing from treaties they signed with the federal government of the U.S., some of them more than 150 years old.

The group also visited the Bolivian, Chilean, South African and Venezuelan embassies, and would continue on their diplomatic mission and take it overseas in the coming weeks and months.

Lakota country includes parts of the states of Nebraska, South Dakota, North Dakota, Montana and Wyoming.

The new country would issue its own passports and driving licences, and living there would be tax-free - provided residents renounce their U.S. citizenship, Mr Means said.

The treaties signed with the U.S. were merely "worthless words on worthless paper," the Lakota freedom activists said.

Withdrawing from the treaties was entirely legal, Means said.

"This is according to the laws of the United States, specifically article six of the constitution,'' which states that treaties are the supreme law of the land, he said.

"It is also within the laws on treaties passed at the Vienna Convention and put into effect by the US and the rest of the international community in 1980. We are legally within our rights to be free and independent,'' said Means.

The Lakota relaunched their journey to freedom in 1974, when they drafted a declaration of continuing independence — an overt play on the title of the United States' Declaration of Independence from England.

Thirty-three years have elapsed since then because "it takes critical mass to combat colonialism and we wanted to make sure that all our ducks were in a row,'' Means said.

One duck moved into place in September, when the United Nations adopted a non-binding declaration on the rights of indigenous peoples — despite opposition from the United States, which said it clashed with its own laws.

"We have 33 treaties with the United States that they have not lived by. They continue to take our land, our water, our children,'' Phyllis Young, who helped organize the first international conference on indigenous rights in Geneva in 1977, told the news conference.

The U.S. "annexation'' of native American land has resulted in once proud tribes such as the Lakota becoming mere "facsimiles of white people,'' said Means.

Oppression at the hands of the U.S. government has taken its toll on the Lakota, whose men have one of the shortest life expectancies - less than 44 years - in the world.

Lakota teen suicides are 150 per cent above the norm for the U.S.; infant mortality is five times higher than the U.S. average; and unemployment is rife, according to the Lakota freedom movement's website.

[daved150]

Tweetfukin eh, that'd be great!! where'd this come from, the onion news? i didnt hear anything about this and i recieve mail on native american matters every month!...i cant wait to see how far this goes, if it's indeed fact!

[T-Man007]

TweetI fore see a case of eminant domain taking place on this issue if they continue. This guy is an idiot. The US ownse everything from coast to coast. This guy can't just take land from states and give it to some other country. LOL, what an idiot. Mark my words, if he continues down this route, the government will exercise condemnation and take the land from them completely. The reason they have those sad statistics is because of their desire to stay segregated. If they would quit being seperatists they would have more resources available to them. Or course, I would assume they refuse western medicine and doing so would obviously lead to shorter life spans. The average life span has increased dramatically over the last 200 years. This has been due to medicine which I'm sure they don't take. The suicide thing is on them, not the US government. They obviously are doing somethign wrong as parents to have that high of a suicide rate. Yeah, I understand the bad apple theory, but with rates that high, it's beyond bad apples, it's poor parenting. If life is so bad for them, why go on? No other government is going to help them any more than we would and certainly no government is going to get that much of our soil.

[mandarb11]

TweetThe status of the Native Indians is the same throughout North America. the high suicide rate is a large part of substance abuse and the lose if identity. Natives have little incentive to progress, the same is true here in Canada. Our treaties are actually much better for the Canadian indians. Where I lived in BC the natives could get a new house for $2000, paid to attend regular school, university education paid for, they do not pay any income tax......they have it made yet their society is plagued with so many horrible things. A few examples, Native girls are lucky if the are not pregnant by 14, suicide rates are huge (a guy I grew up with killed himself in his early 20s), and substance abuse is rampant. It is sad, but I am not to sure how it can be fixed. I have always thought that all these privledges are what makes their society so decrepid, when you receive so much for doing nothing it does not intill a sense of pride/accomplishment.

[Stout1]

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I fore see a case of eminant domain taking place on this issue if they continue. This guy is an idiot. The US ownse everything from coast to coast. This guy can't just take land from states and give it to some other country. LOL, what an idiot. Mark my words, if he continues down this route, the government will exercise condemnation and take the land from them completely. The reason they have those sad statistics is because of their desire to stay segregated. If they would quit being seperatists they would have more resources available to them. Or course, I would assume they refuse western medicine and doing so would obviously lead to shorter life spans. The average life span has increased dramatically over the last 200 years. This has been due to medicine which I'm sure they don't take. The suicide thing is on them, not the US government. They obviously are doing somethign wrong as parents to have that high of a suicide rate. Yeah, I understand the bad apple theory, but with rates that high, it's beyond bad apples, it's poor parenting. If life is so bad for them, why go on? No other government is going to help them any more than we would and certainly no government is going to get that much of our soil.

Imminent Domain? lol I think the Native American Indians were here before us thus making it their land and their soil. If you don't remember we stole, robbed, and killed them for their land. We basically wiped them off the map literally and physically.

[Klash]

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when you receive so much for doing nothing it does not intill a sense of pride/accomplishment.

I agree.

Imminent Domain? lol I think the Native American Indians were here before us thus making it their land and their soil. If you don't remember we stole, robbed, and killed them for their land. We basically wiped them off the map literally and physically.

The Native Americans (NA) were tribal and nomadic - like a group of kids that thinks everything is theirs. The Anglo's were more civilized; they surveyed land, fenced it, forged it, produced from it and had owners who could sale it. NA didn't buy and sale they used force to determine ownership and boundaries. The Anglo's spoke to the Indians in their language - force.

[daved150]

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I agree.



The Native Americans (NA) were tribal and nomadic - like a group of kids that thinks everything is theirs. The Anglo's were more civilized; they surveyed land, fenced it, forged it, produced from it and had owners who could sale it.NA didn't buy and sale they used force to determine ownership and boundaries. The Anglo's spoke to the Indians in their language - force.

please...save that shyt for someone else....NOW, all of a sudden, klash buy's in and believes the media!!, lol....KLASH DUN DRANK THE PUNCH!!!!

[daved150]

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The status of the Native Indians is the same throughout North America. the high suicide rate is a large part of substance abuse and the lose if identity. Natives have little incentive to progress, the same is true here in Canada. Our treaties are actually much better for the Canadian indians. Where I lived in BC the natives could get a new house for $2000, paid to attend regular school, university education paid for, they do not pay any income tax......they have it made yet their society is plagued with so many horrible things. A few examples, Native girls are lucky if the are not pregnant by 14, suicide rates are huge (a guy I grew up with killed himself in his early 20s), and substance abuse is rampant. It is sad, but I am not to sure how it can be fixed. I have always thought that all these privledges are what makes their society so decrepid, when you receive so much for doing nothing it does not intill a sense of pride/accomplishment.

so. basicly, your saying becouse native americans have been given, just sooo much, they are depressed and want to kill themselves?...thats kinda fuked up. becouse of all the gifts that are bestowed upon them...they just cant take it and have to resort to drugs? are you friggin nuts? lol...c'mon. really?...you think this?

[daved150]

Tweetklash...just becouse you dont understand, nor agree with the thaught process of your nieghbors house, and becouse you have supior numbers and are more willing to kill just for the sake of property, does not give you the right to take his house! it maybe a nicer house than yours...but no taking!
fukin indians were lied to, killed, enslaved and used...becouse they were, mainly, peaceful. it was way too late, and way too little when they decided to fight back! when they decided to act as they were being treated, the numbers they had to fight against were far to great. and, even though, out numbered, out muscled, the government negotiated and signed peace agreements that they never intended to live up to. by the time it just became too blatant and obvious that they were gonna get fuked, the "man" (lol) had already ingrained itself so deep into the land, and was so vast in numbers, that nothing could be done. try to understand the people of which you decide to past judgment on...just a little, before you judge.
native americans were a very proud people that contributed greatly to this country. they only took what they needed...they respected the land very much. whats been "given" to them is crap....what was takin from, them was everything!

[daved150]

Tweetyea....kinda struck a nerve here, lol

[T-Man007]

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Imminent Domain? lol I think the Native American Indians were here before us thus making it their land and their soil. If you don't remember we stole, robbed, and killed them for their land. We basically wiped them off the map literally and physically.

My ancestors were Delaware Indians, so I'm very familiar with the story. It still doesnt' change the fact the US can take their land if they want to.

PS, it's Eminent Domain, not Imminent Domain. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eminent_domain

[T-Man007]

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klash...just becouse you dont understand, nor agree with the thaught process of your nieghbors house, and becouse you have supior numbers and are more willing to kill just for the sake of property, does not give you the right to take his house! it maybe a nicer house than yours...but no taking!
fukin indians were lied to, killed, enslaved and used...becouse they were, mainly, peaceful. it was way too late, and way too little when they decided to fight back! when they decided to act as they were being treated, the numbers they had to fight against were far to great. and, even though, out numbered, out muscled, the government negotiated and signed peace agreements that they never intended to live up to. by the time it just became too blatant and obvious that they were gonna get fuked, the "man" (lol) had already ingrained itself so deep into the land, and was so vast in numbers, that nothing could be done. try to understand the people of which you decide to past judgment on...just a little, before you judge.
native americans were a very proud people that contributed greatly to this country. they only took what they needed...they respected the land very much. whats been "given" to them is crap....what was takin from, them was everything!

I'll tell you exactly why they were really killed, fear. You have to realize, when this country was settled, the average height of a man was about 5'8" and the average height of a male indian was abotu 6'1" to 6"2" (they have bone fossils to prove this). So, here you are, new to a land with men who literally tower over you in height, muscle and strength. Yeah, they coined the tern 'savages' but the truth is they feared them. They saw how well they could kill. The very fact they could shoot a bow (well, some tribes) with pin point accuracy while riding horse back scared the hell out of early settlers. Let's face it, they were by far superior in every way except housing construction and civilized clothing.

Do some research on my ancestors the Delaware Indians and see how they were slaughtered by an entire union army. I had a bro back in ATL that was full blood indian (I forget the tribe) and he told me horrible stories about what they did to my mom's ancestors.

[DJDIGGLER]

TweetThe indians were screwed, and they deserve to do whatever they please within their own boundaries. If they want to make it their own land, so be it. It's the least this country owes to them.

It seems like our country is so set on repaying for slavery. So why do the indians get screwed? They weren't put into slavery, we just outright stole their land and killed off their people. I think we owe them more than any other race/culture!

[T-Man007]

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The indians were screwed, and they deserve to do whatever they please within their own boundaries. If they want to make it their own land, so be it. It's the least this country owes to them.

It seems like our country is so set on repaying for slavery. So why do the indians get screwed? They weren't put into slavery, we just outright stole their land and killed off their people. I think we owe them more than any other race/culture!

Doing what they want with their land is one thing, but entertaining foreign governments is another thing. We can't just let people give control of their land to foreign governments.

I for one feel they should be given better land or at the very least give funding to improve the lands they live on and offer them more than we do now. The indigent in this country get more things than native americans. This is ass backwards. The native american did nothing wrong but if they try to give control of their land to a foreign government then they will bring trouble on themselves like you can't imagine. What happens next, we allow them to have their own military? Where does it end?

Like I said, they 'should' be allowed to do what they want with their country but the land is still within the US boundaries. The only soil that the US doesn't recognize is that which is under foreign embassies.

There is no doubt that the indians got a bad deal, no dobut about it. But, what they are doing is going to cause them more trouble than good. If the guy wanted to ripple the water, he should have taken his case to get more support public. There are millions of people that would agree that this country owes the native americans. We could very easily snub a few billion off of our ridiculous military budget and give it to them to imporve their way of life.

I think this group is going about this the wrong way, but that's my opinion.

[Klash]

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yea....kinda struck a nerve here, lol

I guess so but that was not my intention. I'm just giving you my opinion. I think when people identify themselves with groups of people based on ethnicity it can bring strong emotions to a topic that should be more easily viewed objectively. How can you be proud of your heritage without seeing it as a superior heritage or at least seeing someone else's as harmful. Look at the middle east. Many problems over there could be more easily solved if people stopped identifying themselves with their "heritage" of Persian, Palestinian, Jewish, etc. descent and started thinking of themselves as individuals. The justification for holding a grudge against an ethnicity that "mistreated" the ethnicity you identify yourself with is emotionally investing in something that is giving you nothing but bitterness in return.

please...save that shyt for someone else....NOW, all of a sudden, klash buy's in and believes the media!!, lol....KLASH DUN DRANK THE PUNCH!!!!

What media does not suggest the white man is an evil doer simply because he was more civilized and technologically advanced than the Indians, who are portrayed in a more romantic fashion as having "respected" their land. What nomadic tribe wouldn't have met this so called "respected" criteria; it's not respect, they just didn't have the advances beyond modified sticks and stones - so the decisions they faced were not as controversial.

klash...just becouse you dont understand, nor agree with the thaught process of your nieghbors house, and becouse you have supior numbers and are more willing to kill just for the sake of property, does not give you the right to take his house! it maybe a nicer house than yours...but no taking!

This analogy does not fit.
The Indians were nomadic and were not civilized in law or rights. They would not have had a house and if they did they wouldn't let you have one next to it. And if you bought a house, fenced your land and some guy came over in a cow hide skirt on a horse and said you were on his property and you asked him where his property ended and he replied from the shore to as far as you can see. You'd tell him to get lost too. War was inevitable. It was a clash of civilizations. Anglo's had a legal system and the Indian had a weather route.

fukin indians were lied to, killed, enslaved and used...becouse they were, mainly, peaceful. it was way too late, and way too little when they decided to fight back! when they decided to act as they were being treated, the numbers they had to fight against were far to great. and, even though, out numbered, out muscled, the government negotiated and signed peace agreements that they never intended to live up to. by the time it just became too blatant and obvious that they were gonna get fuked, the "man" (lol) had already ingrained itself so deep into the land, and was so vast in numbers, that nothing could be done. try to understand the people of which you decide to past judgment on...just a little, before you judge.
native americans were a very proud people that contributed greatly to this country. they only took what they needed...they respected the land very much. whats been "given" to them is crap....what was takin from, them was everything!

You don't think the Indians lied, killed and enslaved? They weren't mainly peaceful, they were militarily inferior and brutal.

Muslim extremist are a very proud people too, doesn't make them any more appealing to me. This slogan that they only took what was need is misleading, again they were nomadic; that's how you act when you are hunting, gathering and moving with the seasons. I seriously doubt thy needed all the bison they would run off of the cliffs.

Your romanticizing the idea of the Native Americans - they were uncivilized humans.