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Originally Posted by baby1

EVERYBODY does not believe that there was no connection between 911 and Iraq. That is many Liberal's point of view. Idea or not, terrorism is real and certainly exists.

if ANYBODY believes that iraq was in any way connected with 9/11 theyve been living with their heads either in the sands or up their arse!!!
terrorism has always and will always exsist...GEORGE BUSH IS A TERRORIST!!!!
LOOK UP THE MEANING OF THE WORD!!!
ITS NOT A LIBERALS POINT OF VIEW THAT IRAQ WASNT INVOLVED IN 9/11...ITS AN EDUCATED PERSONS...THERE IS NOT..AND NEVER HAS BEEN ANY EVIDENCE TO SUGGEST THEY WERE INVOLVED...

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Originally Posted by trip

hate motivates deep, how many young iraqi's have had family killed or murdered in the war and they did nothing to desrve it, had not one thing to do with our freedom

the false believe that terrorism is something that can be stopped and won in a war is not very real

u can identify it, contain it, work against it, yet, to believe it can be defeated is too believe you can control peoples thoughts

--Trip to an extent I do agree with you. But look at this… those same families who have lost would have lost the same or more under Sadaam. No different than the families of the Revolutionary war. One similarity is that we have, and did then, a voluntary army. I served, my father served, My Grandfather served and so did my Great Grand father and his father served. That is the sacrifice that a few make for so many and why we can discuss this issue. Different view points make this the best country in the world. Yes there are more than 4200 lives that have been lost in more than five years of war, and I'd gladly give mine in exchange for any of those soldiers, but look at the past and see where so many brave souls gave their lives. They Volunteered. They Gave. They Died. And we can discuss. BUT NEVER FORGET THEM!

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Originally Posted by FROGMAN

--Trip to an extent I do agree with you. But look at this… those same families who have lost would have lost the same or more under Sadaam. No different than the families of the Revolutionary war. One similarity is that we have, and did then, a voluntary army. I served, my father served, My Grandfather served and so did my Great Grand father and his father served. That is the sacrifice that a few make for so many and why we can discuss this issue. Different view points make this the best country in the world. Yes there are more than 4200 lives that have been lost in more than five years of war, and I'd gladly give mine in exchange for any of those soldiers, but look at the past and see where so many brave souls gave their lives. They Volunteered. They Gave. They Died. And we can discuss. BUT NEVER FORGET THEM!

u cannot state factually what families would FEEL, and thus form value systems under Saddam, and how they would respond, i though am fairly confident alot of hatred has been built up because we've killed over 100,000 irqi's and maimend another 80k, that hatred takes two generations too abate

the revolutionary war was fought over the constitution, by americans on both sides, it only took 100 years for the south to finally abandon vehement hatred and treatment of blacks, and the period was put on that century by the civil rights movement and enacting into law what was 100 years overdue

now two generations have been born, and while there is still hatred, it's by idiots and nut jobs, and fortunately demographically they are few

my point is almost everything u do as a government has a 70 year footprint, 70 years, most folks don't think past 7 weeks

bin laden didn't hate us because we were rich or not muslims, he hates we did not step in and help save 6 million afgans who died, again, i'm not debating that point, all i'm saying is that nut jobs in a way are created by the times

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Originally Posted by trip

hate motivates deep, how many young iraqi's have had family killed or murdered in the war and they did nothing to desrve it, had not one thing to do with our freedom

the false believe that terrorism is something that can be stopped and won in a war is not very real

u can identify it, contain it, work against it, yet, to believe it can be defeated is too believe you can control peoples thoughts

Hate does motivate, but you must recall how many of Sadams own people didi he kill??? Chemical Alli- remember him?? I believe more than the innocent that have been killed in this war-and not all were innocent. I would much rather keep the fight in thier backyard than mine

Tweetyou see...this is where people are getting things twisted...
they want to tax the higher tier to take the burden off of us average folks...
your boy mccain wants to give his good ol boys up there a tax break...feed the rich and steal from the poor..im sorry..but im not down with that...

Tweetwhat to do, what to do....lets see...tax the working class and you continue to hurt the very people that make this country work...tax the upper tier/corporate and
a) they move MORE jobs out of the country
b) they pass along those increases to us, the consumer..

i dont see the argument here guys...either way....YOUR PAYING!!!
we're gonna either have our jobs taxed away, or we'll have the money our jobs pay us taxed away

Tweetfuzo,

If i hear you right, if someone kills someone in your family, you now have the right too kill anyone you want?

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Originally Posted by trip

fuzo,

If i hear you right, if someone kills someone in your family, you now have the right too kill anyone you want?

I can't speak for Fuzo, but I doubt that is what he means.

TweetLet’s see, I make almost 11k a month an then I get less than 6 k back. I don’t care about taxing those who make 250k more or the poor family with six kids who make 19k a year. We all know that either candidate will raise taxes after this bailout but Obama and Biden believe in the distribution of cash (not wealth b/c many who fall in this bracket are the small business owners who generate the GNP for this government which Obama will decimate in four years) for those who have less. Not to mention, kill this economy. Great, give them the money they want but I want proof that these people make sure their kids are going to school or hold them responsible… oh wait, the government is here for that.. Life is not fair. Not everyone can live on the hill. Nor should EVVERYONE have the 4k square foot home with 4 cars…this isn’t a Cribs episode. Shit, I wanted to be an astronaut and that is why I spent three years in the Air Force. Obviously, I’m not. Things like this should be for those who give it their all to succeed and MAYBE make it. It has been mentioned where JOURNALISM has died in 2008 but WHEN DID DEMOCRACY & CAPITALISM die in 2008(and yes I know that we live in a Republic even though the media & our government tells us different). I predict a socialistic government in the next 20 years. But that doesn’t bother me. I’ll just go to Brasil where the medicine is cheap, the health care is free & sucks and oh BTW the crime rates are high and if you’re a male your life expectancy is less than 35…oh and taxes are high too. I can ***** because I have paid more for where I am than most, have traveled the world, learned new languages and have seen where Michael Moore wants us to be…places like Europe, Canada, South Africa, Brasil and yes India. Places where in his mind, i.e. Cuba are so great with a “Hospital on every corner”. But I’m really tired of hearing all the reasons for Him to say these places are so GREAT and ***** about the good ole’ USA. I don’t want to hear about those who might think they DESERVE to be where I am. I am not a Republican nor a Democrat. I don’t care about government other than the tax me the least and leave me alone. Take care of REAL crime. Take care of our protection and our National security and quit being so DAMN POLITICALLY or ENVIRONMENTALLY Correct. All they do is hurt things when that is their mantra… I only care is when that 5k+ doesn’t go into my pocket and where I want to spend it….oh like my mom, who is a widower and I’d rather see her get the healthcare and medicine that my 5k dollars can give her….I’ll step off the soapbox now, got to go eat a large pizza, take some somas & anti-depressants and fat burners, have a box of wine and maybe some beers cause their legal….but I can’t buy some gear…even though I live in the greatest county in the world…Go figure.

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GEORGE BUSH IS A TERRORIST!!!!

wow stray you really do hate these men and its been in these posts lately with bush and mccain.honestly stray do you think you should stay in the military I mean you hate the un you hate the govornment you hate the commander in cheif-sp? you hate war so why stay in the service if you cant back the united states of america and listen I'm not attacking you but kinda curious

let me clarify if i'm in the service i will uphold any decision my commander in cheif says.

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Originally Posted by FUZO

wow stray you really do hate these men and its been in these posts lately with bush and mccain.honestly stray do you think you should stay in the military I mean you hate the un you hate the govornment you hate the commander in cheif-sp? you hate war so why stay in the service if you cant back the united states of america and listen I'm not attacking you but kinda curious

let me clarify if i'm in the service i will uphold any decision my commander in cheif says.

heres the paradox fuzo..i swore to uphold the constitution of the united states and the orders of those appointed over me...
so when they conflict each other i have to choose sides..i choose the side of the constitution...
i cant not say enough that i love my country...i just want it back..i want it back from the elitists...from the corporations...i wish it were really for the people like it was meant to be...the government is stealing everything that we are...and theyre getting away with it..for kryste sakes they just taxed our children and our grandchildren with these bailouts...did they ask us? do they ever ask our opinions for anything?...we put them there to serve us..not themselves...and do you want to know why im staying in the military?
because theyre running the country into the ground and i need to have a job and stability..thats why...call me selfish..but im looking out for number one and my family...

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Originally Posted by trip

u cannot state factually what families would FEEL, and thus form value systems under Saddam, and how they would respond, I though am fairly confident allot of hatred has been built up because we've killed over 100,000 Iraqi’s and maimed another 80k, that hatred takes two generations too abate.

--I do not factually know. But people shoud agree but there are more factors than just hate of Sadaam that should be considered. When you say “we killed” is that the US or the Militants?

The revolutionary war was fought over the constitution, by Americans on both sides, it only took 100 years for the south to finally abandon vehement hatred and treatment of blacks, and the period was put on that century by the civil rights movement and enacting into law what was 100 years overdue
-- I agree. But to you earlier point compare and contrast. I’m just offering a perspective that many Americans could correlate. But throw the towel over me because my maternal side of the family owned slaves abet for a brief period of 8 years, but their generations have taught me and my family not to think of colour but personal characteristic as the most important thing. And both sides of my family gave lives to insure the constition that we commonly refer too.

Now two generations have been born, and while there is still hatred, it's by idiots and nut jobs, and fortunately demographically they are few

--I agree with you on hatred.

My point is almost everything u do as a government has a 70 year footprint, 70 years, most folks don't think past 7 weeks

bin laden didn't hate us because we were rich or not Muslims, he hates we did not step in and help save 6 million afghans who died, again, I’m not debating that point, all I’m saying is that nut jobs in a way are created by the times

--Trip where do you see the next 70 years and how this country should grow?

TweetOne last thing for us to ponder as Americans... where can we as a people, under one nation, under different Gods go to make life better without suffocating the fundamentals of the economy?

Tweeticeland...canada....amsterdam....costa rica...im suree there are a few more..i dont feel like thinking..lol

Tweeteverybody is fukin high in amsterdam....