Great article on the reality of the government's agenda

[trip]

Re: Great article on the reality of the government's agenda

well well well walker has some other union problems in his past

the reality is wisconsins money problems ain't that bad

this is pure and simple contract law, imho, this has greater magnitude, if the government can null and void contracts they don't like, the rule of law becomes weaker day by day, i've watched two speeches by walker i get really bad vibes from the guy, the speeches were terrible in a crisis situation, don't trust him at all, my guess is he has ulterior motives, i would not be surprised to see a campaign too throw him out

[FUZO]

Re: Great article on the reality of the government's agenda

well well well walker has some other union problems in his past

the reality is wisconsins money problems ain't that bad

this is pure and simple contract law, imho, this has greater magnitude, if the government can null and void contracts they don't like, the rule of law becomes weaker day by day, i've watched two speeches by walker i get really bad vibes from the guy, the speeches were terrible in a crisis situation, don't trust him at all, my guess is he has ulterior motives, i would not be surprised to see a campaign too throw him out

Your speculations are just as any other liberal would say,and 3 billion in debt is just pennies huh

[trip]

Re: Great article on the reality of the government's agenda

it is not speculation, just google walker, he fired union employee's before

this is 100% political strategy that is a win win win for walker

let's say he break bargaining right

he will be exalted to the status of lech walensa in the republican party
he will be the budget savior
he will be the job savior

he loses this gambit

well, hell they wouldn't bargain, tough titty
now, he has to fire folks, he has too pay unemployment and teachers have low job prospect, he will be paying unemployement a long time, negating quite a bit of his gains
he messes with student count, it will go above 35 per class, not good for quality

but hell i did what i said i'd do

now, note, no firefighters and policeman, who have eseentially the same contracts are involved in this, wonder why, well if these guys go on strike and people die he's a dead man walking

this is pure polictical strategy, high stakes, yet, the stakes are in this guys favor, he has very little too lose and he always has an out cause there conceding the money

avg teacher pay 51.5k, below national averages

mho, is this guy stinks like shyte, it's all about him

[FUZO]

Re: Great article on the reality of the government's agenda

WHY DOES THIS HAVE TO BE A STRATEGY WHEN THE STATE IS 3 BILLION IN DEBT AND WHEN THIS VOTE GETS PASSED BECAUSE IT WILL HE WILL START SAVING MONEY FOR THE STATE.BUT YOU SAY TEACHERS ONLY MAKE $51K, TRIP THATS PREETY GOOD FOR SOMEONE WHO HAS THE SUMMER OFF DUDE. LIKE I SAID TYPICAL SAYING FOR A DEMOCRAT.

[JsJs24]

Re: Great article on the reality of the government's agenda

well well well walker has some other union problems in his past

the reality is wisconsins money problems ain't that bad

this is pure and simple contract law, imho, this has greater magnitude, if the government can null and void contracts they don't like, the rule of law becomes weaker day by day, i've watched two speeches by walker i get really bad vibes from the guy, the speeches were terrible in a crisis situation, don't trust him at all, my guess is he has ulterior motives, i would not be surprised to see a campaign too throw him out

I see the debt there as a problem, 3.5 billion is not chump change. I think it is a good idea to fix the problem now before it gets worse, otherwise they may end up looking at double or triple that number. If a state waits to react after they are in the shape of CA or NJ, then it is too late. CA will never get their debt back to a sustainable level, especially with Dems (socialists) running the state. They will ask the federal government for a bailout eventually, and they will get it. Then every other state in trouble will run to them with their hands out. But that will only weaken our currency further. Actually, I am almost to the point of believing there is nothing that can be done to save our currency. It seems we have passed the point of no return, and again, with a Dem in office its hopeless. I'm not saying Republicans would necessarily fix it either, but the governors of some of these states such as Ohio and WI are showing that they aren't all talk. Regardless of their intentions they are at least trying to get spending and debt to sustainable levels. I don't know of any Democrat governors who would ever attempt the same, nor will the President. Obama is going to have added $5 trillion in new debt before his term is up. That is so freaking crazy that it makes me wonder if it he is trying to intentionally destroy the currency, along with the help of Bernanke.

[JsJs24]

Re: Great article on the reality of the government's agenda

I'd like to add something in regard to unions. The unions there are complaining because they are facing premium increases and potentially losing their collective bargaining for benefits only, not for wages. Anyway, it is crazy when you think about it. My company doesn't give us a chance to say anything when something has to change in regard to our benefits or pay. Just a few years ago they made my job a salary position across the board, in which no overtime can be earned, but instead you can get strait time pay for extra hours worked. This happened across the company, except for the union employees at the manufacturing plant. Then last year they came up with another new rule that says you can't get overtime until after 45 hours, or should I say strait time. Additionally, our health benefits have increased two years in a row, for more than a 50% increase per paycheck deducted. You see, my company, though a large fortune 500, has felt the recession and had to make adjustments to remain profitable. Well, it works apparently because the stock has come back strong, profits are back up, and nobody got laid off. However, in the unions, and state union jobs in the case with WI, they freak out over any little change attempted. But here in the private sector non-union world we don't get to argue crap. If we don't like it we can hit the road, but seldom does anyone do that because they know they still have a job at least, and pretty darn good ones still yet. Do I like having these changes? No, of course not. But I understand it. And I also understand that if it gets too bad I can start looking for a job with a different company that offers better incentives. For those of us working on the non-union side I think we have a better understanding of the economics of the private market.

[trip]

Re: Great article on the reality of the government's agenda

I'd like to add something in regard to unions. The unions there are complaining because they are facing premium increases and potentially losing their collective bargaining for benefits only, not for wages. Anyway, it is crazy when you think about it. My company doesn't give us a chance to say anything when something has to change in regard to our benefits or pay. Just a few years ago they made my job a salary position across the board, in which no overtime can be earned, but instead you can get strait time pay for extra hours worked. This happened across the company, except for the union employees at the manufacturing plant. Then last year they came up with another new rule that says you can't get overtime until after 45 hours, or should I say strait time. Additionally, our health benefits have increased two years in a row, for more than a 50% increase per paycheck deducted. You see, my company, though a large fortune 500, has felt the recession and had to make adjustments to remain profitable. Well, it works apparently because the stock has come back strong, profits are back up, and nobody got laid off. However, in the unions, and state union jobs in the case with WI, they freak out over any little change attempted. But here in the private sector non-union world we don't get to argue crap. If we don't like it we can hit the road, but seldom does anyone do that because they know they still have a job at least, and pretty darn good ones still yet. Do I like having these changes? No, of course not. But I understand it. And I also understand that if it gets too bad I can start looking for a job with a different company that offers better incentives. For those of us working on the non-union side I think we have a better understanding of the economics of the private market.

the question is what's ur total comp package over the last 5 years, i'd guess starting 3 years ago your flat or down, so the whole sentiment is most workers have felt the pain the public employee's no

the person making 51k will take an 8% hair cut in take home, 4k

again if u google it wisconsin is actually historically well run fiscally, and is not in dire straits at all, i looked an i have no idea where they get 3 billion, they have a 150 million, shortfall this fiscal year, but u can bet union folks know the numbers to the penney

all i'm saying is from again, 20 minutes of simple research it's bullshyte

as opposed to when i read the fed budget, that again, unmitigated pure fantasy, as to be embarrasing

imho, he has screwed up, what he did in milwakee he could do on a small scale because lot's of employee's were not voters in the city, here he's statewide and u can bet every family has a teacher in it, i have 3 teachers in my family, one retired aunt, husband died so she gets the jersey pension benefits, and an aunt who was a jersey teacher for 20 years who passed, non are rich, non live lavishly, my sentiment is them for not too lose rights, and the way he is doing this stinks too high heaven

[ketsugo]

Re: Great article on the reality of the government's agenda

Things dont look so good. I think many voters are still clueless

[trip]

Re: Great article on the reality of the government's agenda

3 billion comes from pension says walker

facts, 80 billion in pension fund, pays out 3.7 billion, it is 99% funded for the next 30 years, that rates it in the top 1% of funds

50% of fund is run by state, costs for employee's 30 million
50% by wall street, cost 200 million

shyte, fire wall street and problem solved

he's trying to stick teachers with 30 million in extra's

this is total unmitagted fcked up bad management, which means it's all political bs

walker is a dick imho

total time, 30 minutes to form my own evalution

like the union folks don't know these numbers, but media only cares about a fight fight fight to generate clicks or viewers

[FUZO]

Re: Great article on the reality of the government's agenda

all i'm saying is he had to pick a direction

You keep saying he had to pick a direction,NO trip he didnt pick a direction he wanted to go in this direction,he wanted more Gov,he wanted redistribution of money,he wants people on Gov assistance.

soon as he get in he passes 150 million in tax cuts to stimulate small business so they can move from illinois to wisconsin, he says, he illionois is taxing the hell out of small biz, we will lure them up here by giving them breaks, again this is propaganda bs all people belive, bottom line this tax cut will go too existing business's in wisconsin that have 1k,3k number of employee's to cut expenses and reap more profits, almost no new jobs will be created, and u can bet the unions know this, yet, newsmakers can't report boring facts, they need a fight fight fight to keep audineces engaged and get ad dollars

ASSUME--MAKES A ASS OUT OF YOU.

[JsJs24]

Re: Great article on the reality of the government's agenda

the question is what's ur total comp package over the last 5 years, i'd guess starting 3 years ago your flat or down, so the whole sentiment is most workers have felt the pain the public employee's no

the person making 51k will take an 8% hair cut in take home, 4k

again if u google it wisconsin is actually historically well run fiscally, and is not in dire straits at all, i looked an i have no idea where they get 3 billion, they have a 150 million, shortfall this fiscal year, but u can bet union folks know the numbers to the penney

all i'm saying is from again, 20 minutes of simple research it's bullshyte

as opposed to when i read the fed budget, that again, unmitigated pure fantasy, as to be embarrasing

imho, he has screwed up, what he did in milwakee he could do on a small scale because lot's of employee's were not voters in the city, here he's statewide and u can bet every family has a teacher in it, i have 3 teachers in my family, one retired aunt, husband died so she gets the jersey pension benefits, and an aunt who was a jersey teacher for 20 years who passed, non are rich, non live lavishly, my sentiment is them for not too lose rights, and the way he is doing this stinks too high heaven

First off, every research Ive seen shows 3.6 billion, including the Austrian Economists who have written on it. Second, my contention is that unions are terrible for the economy. Let the free market decide on the wages and benefits for those teachers and firefighters. Their retirement packages are lush with benefits. A union works against the free market. This is not rocket science, nor is it an opinion. It is a fact. And I also come from a family of school teachers. My grandmother, great grandmother,(deceased), aunt, grandfather (principal), and brother (professor), 2 cousins (professors). But I don't care what their jobs were, I'll sit there and look them in the eye and tell them the union is bs. My brother is in SC and not in a union, nor does he want to be. Interesting, as a free market economics professor he says the unions are destroying the states too. My entire family just about is in the boilermakers union, stepfather, 3 uncles, grandfather retired, and I will tell them all the same thing too. Their benefits packages are higher than my mothers who is a GS-14 Federal Employee. My uncle was in a car wreck recently that put him out of work and his union penion and social security combined is $6,000 a month. That's insane, and for only about 20 years work because he goofed off so many years in his life leaving his job and returning. He is clearing $72,000 a month. That's one heck of a pension. When I sit around the table with the family during the holidays and work comes up it feels like a bunch of socialists or communists just sat down at the table the way they go off about other companies and workers. Then the people back home (WV) who take union work while they are on strike, known as scabs, their houses get vandalized, some of them get beat up, their lives are threatened, etc. The most shameful thing of it all is instead of the U.S. being a right to work country, we are a right not to work. The unions are protected and afforded their right not to work while on strike. Conversely, scabs are punished if they attempt to work in place of them. How much more pathetic and backward can it get.

[JsJs24]

Re: Great article on the reality of the government's agenda

3 billion comes from pension says walker

facts, 80 billion in pension fund, pays out 3.7 billion, it is 99% funded for the next 30 years, that rates it in the top 1% of funds

50% of fund is run by state, costs for employee's 30 million
50% by wall street, cost 200 million

shyte, fire wall street and problem solved

he's trying to stick teachers with 30 million in extra's

this is total unmitagted fcked up bad management, which means it's all political bs

walker is a dick imho

total time, 30 minutes to form my own evalution

like the union folks don't know these numbers, but media only cares about a fight fight fight to generate clicks or viewers

The people voted for the governor to get spending in control. The Dems know this and are still upset over it. Their strike will ensure more Dems lose their jobs, especially the ones who fled the state.

I will look into the numbers when I have time. I cannot imagine the Austrians missed $3.6 billion, and then you spend 30 minutes and dispute reputable economists. There has to be something you're missing. They campaigned on curtailing spending so you are saying there never was a debt problem in WI, then how come Dems didn't campaign on it being a big lie. Still, even if spending was in control, I would still support the governor. Like I said before, I would have already fired every one of them and replaced them with people ready and willing to work. They need to learn a lesson like Reagan taught the Air Traffic Controllers. When is the last time they decided to go on strike. If these governors don't set an example then every state will eventually have protests. Our country will look like another socialist country, which it is almost anyway.

[JsJs24]

Re: Great article on the reality of the government's agenda

Okay, I'm finding some things that may show that the budget is not as bad as it sounds, and the Austrians may be going off of projected shortfalls, as is everyone else it sounds like. I'll finish up some research and get back to you Trip. Still, I will never support the Unions, and always will support anything that strips their power away so long as it is within the law.

[trip]

Re: Great article on the reality of the government's agenda

im not pro-inion

i'm pro promises, they're breaking a friggin contract, like i said there's dozen ways too solve listen to the prnak phone call

[FUZO]

Re: Great article on the reality of the government's agenda

im not pro-inion

i'm pro promises, they're breaking a friggin contract, like i said there's dozen ways too solve listen to the prnak phone call

Only you Liberals which is a small % think its breaking the contract but to the rest of the country its not.Is that the best you can do Trip is talk about a prank call.