So sad!

[T-Man007]

Re: So sad!

I'd love to see you say the same thing if someone came over here to 'SO CALLED' Free us! Hey we're going to free your country, but meanwhile we're going to steal your oil, and then build a humongous fortress here so we can have indirect control of your nation. Yeah that's freedom allright. American Freedom. Maybe we can help them with their constitution and show them how not to follow it. Our governments good at not following our constitution!

It wouldn't ever happen here. We created the free world when we broke away from England. So, it's an unrealistic hypothetical. And, you really think the oil leaves Iraq without them knowing about it? Because that's what stealing is. They are selling it to us, we are not stealing it. You act like we are in control of their oil, which we are not. We don't have American Oil companies other there just taking the oil, you do realize that, right? Because if we did, they would have all been bombed already. So, it's safe to say, the oil is still in control of Iraq. Of course, I haven't physically been over there to say for sure, but the fact the insurgents aren't bombing the oil plants is a pretty logical conclusions.

[T-Man007]

Re: So sad!

Here is what the Iraqis should do:

First, they need to take note of every country that has every been liberated. France, Poland, Russia, China, etc. Now, have you ever watched any of the old WWII videos of when our troops came through? What did you notice? That's right, no civilians hardly at all. Why do you think that was? Because they were smart enough to get the hell out! Good lord, leave, just leave. This crap has been going on for 4 years and these people still don't get it. The insurgents don't care about their own countrymen. Period. You didn't see the French just haning around while we fought the Germans did you? Of course not, because they were smart enough to leave. Now, you may ask, why should they leave? Well, if they want to live, that's the only logical option. You can bet your ass if this country was invaded and we were over taken my ass would leave. I would go to where ever I had to to keep my family safe. I would starve, I would wrok my hands to the bones and I would do whatever it takes to survive. But, that's coming from a logical thinker. Not the kind of person who lives in an area where civilians get killed everyday and then act all dumb founded when it happens to my family. It's not like they are leaving behind anything of realy value. The live in dirt houses with very little land and I'm sure they have some kind of family in safer areas, so leave. Anyways, that's just my opinon. People may differ and that's their right, but that's what I would do and that's what I think they should do.

[daved150]

Re: So sad!

For one you shoot at who's shooting at you. If you don't know you get to cover and find out where it's coming from. Then isolate and decimate!

Number two you don't occupy countries to steal their oil. If you occupy someones home to steal their belongings your bound to get shot. They don't belong there and the USA needs to get their assses out of Iraq ASAP!

We don't kill people for religon? What about freaks assasinating doctors for performing abortions because it's against their religon? What about people bombing abortion clinics because it's against religon?

As for turning against each other, the only reason they are doing that is because they are fighting for control. Are you saying we have never fought each other for control? What about the Civil War? You can't tell me that a huge number of people didn't die over different ideals and beliefs!

To top it off I'd also like to add that we've been involved in more wars in the last three hundred years, than any other country in the world. What do you think others opinions are of us? Do you think it's easy for them to put themselves in our shoes?

ok bro...the freaks with the abortion clinic annalogy, you feel thats on the same level as sunni vs ****e's? ok, right. also...our civil war hasnt gone on for nearly as many decades!!! please bro...you are comparing our ways, our society with thiers?? really? you believe that we are on the same level socially as the middle east? your saying our values of life for our nieghbors are on the same level? so, are you saying there is a certain american people, rerligion or otherwise, that you feel need to be gased out of existance? who is this unfortunate group? i dont want to join them!
you say "get out"...bro, wether we should've or shouldnt have gone in is mute...we're there, and even the most stringent anti-war polititians dont agree that we should just pull out. and, while your running for cover and trying to make absolutly sure you know who is shooting at you, i'm sure it'll be perfectly clear who it is, as the bullet rips through you! and the stealing oil thing...come on...you STILL believe that crap? ok...like every country in the world's leadership wouldnt be screaming at the top of their lungs for the oil we are stealing!!! and back to the civil war....bro, the north or the south did not want to wipe eachother of the face of the earth...you think that whats happening in iraq is mearly for controll? no-way...they want eachother gone! it's not as simple as controll, it's about extinction. has been for centuries. and it's a way of thinking that i, and i expect you, could never wrap our heads around...you say we've been in more war's in the last 300 years than anyothr country...dude, we could be at war for the next 300, and we'd never scratch the surface in the number of years that the middle east has been at war...dont kid yourself.

[daved150]

Re: So sad!

You can bet your ass if this country was invaded and we were over taken my ass would leave. I would go to where ever I had to to keep my family safe. I would starve, I would wrok my hands to the bones and I would do whatever it takes to survive. .

ok bro...i've re-thaught the "paintball" team thing...maybe you should be on o2's team, lol....j/king with ya bro, you know i love ya...(but really...o2 could use ya)

[DJDIGGLER]

Re: So sad!

It wouldn't ever happen here. We created the free world when we broke away from England. So, it's an unrealistic hypothetical. And, you really think the oil leaves Iraq without them knowing about it? Because that's what stealing is. They are selling it to us, we are not stealing it. You act like we are in control of their oil, which we are not. We don't have American Oil companies other there just taking the oil, you do realize that, right? Because if we did, they would have all been bombed already. So, it's safe to say, the oil is still in control of Iraq. Of course, I haven't physically been over there to say for sure, but the fact the insurgents aren't bombing the oil plants is a pretty logical conclusions.

According to many many people I know that have served in Iraq it's a total different story!

Plus of course it was a unrealistic hypothetical. The point was to show you how you put yourself in other peoples shoes. Doing that is what helps people make good decisions. You need to ask yourself how you would feel if you were in their situation, WITHOUT being biased to your own western beliefs.

Anytime I do anything I always try to think like the other person to see how I would feel.

Man if you really do think this has nothing to do with Oil then you need to start doing more research. Even the people on the opposite side of the fence from my belief admit it's about oil in the documentaries I watch. Some of them even go as far as to say "Wouldn't you give a few american lives for some oil?!" That's the type of stuff that enrages me! So many are willing to turn a cheek if it means filling thier pockets.

You might be wise Tmann......But like my sig says, "True wisdom is knowing that you know nothing!" And that is why I continue to do research. There is so much I don't know. You should do the same if your so passionate about your country.

[T-Man007]

Re: So sad!

ok bro...i've re-thaught the "paintball" team thing...maybe you should be on o2's team, lol....j/king with ya bro, you know i love ya...(but really...o2 could use ya)

LOL! Since it would never happen, I was pretending as if we were in the same shoes as Iraq, so it's all just 'whatever'. LOL Rest assured, if we were in the middle of an attack....me and some of my good ol' boys from GA would be hiding in the mountains with more guns than a small army and not to mention all the dirty tactics we would use. But, like I said, it's such a far fetched hypotheical situation, I gave the absolute worse possible senario of what I would do. In other words, I would just sit around in the streets while gun fights were taking place. Duh...where's my sign?

[DJDIGGLER]

Re: So sad!

ok bro...the freaks with the abortion clinic annalogy, you feel thats on the same level as sunni vs ****e's? ok, right. also...our civil war hasnt gone on for nearly as many decades!!! please bro...you are comparing our ways, our society with thiers?? really? you believe that we are on the same level socially as the middle east? your saying our values of life for our nieghbors are on the same level? so, are you saying there is a certain american people, rerligion or otherwise, that you feel need to be gased out of existance? who is this unfortunate group? i dont want to join them!
you say "get out"...bro, wether we should've or shouldnt have gone in is mute...we're there, and even the most stringent anti-war polititians dont agree that we should just pull out. and, while your running for cover and trying to make absolutly sure you know who is shooting at you, i'm sure it'll be perfectly clear who it is, as the bullet rips through you! and the stealing oil thing...come on...you STILL believe that crap? ok...like every country in the world's leadership wouldnt be screaming at the top of their lungs for the oil we are stealing!!! and back to the civil war....bro, the north or the south did not want to wipe eachother of the face of the earth...you think that whats happening in iraq is mearly for controll? no-way...they want eachother gone! it's not as simple as controll, it's about extinction. has been for centuries. and it's a way of thinking that i, and i expect you, could never wrap our heads around...you say we've been in more war's in the last 300 years than anyothr country...dude, we could be at war for the next 300, and we'd never scratch the surface in the number of years that the middle east has been at war...dont kid yourself.

First off your putting words in my mouth. I was saying that people don't only die for religon in the middle east. If you want to be technical more people have died in the name of god than for any other reason in history! So you can take your "The middle east is the problem" Ideal and toss it out the window.

I my friend do not discriminate or segregate because of ones beliefs, nationality, or the color of their skin. I feel equal pain for the innocents that die over there, that I do for innocents that die here! There will always be war aslong as people don't understand that we are all the same but with different views. If you don't see that just look at all of the political debates we have here. So many different views, so many different beliefs.

Also as for the comparing part I was trying to get you guys to understand and see the other persons view. I was trying to help you put yourself in the other persons shoes. But of course you guys ALWAYS put words in my mouth, and make it seem like I flame people, or say stuff I don't. I don't get why it's so hard to just see both viewpoints.

And where the f do you get off saying I think anyone needs to be gassed out of existence? Where the hell did I say that in my post? NOWHERE! Again you people put words in my mouth and try to make it seem like I said shiit I didn't to make your point right. Well your point isn't right and you know why???!!! BECAUSE IT IS BIASED AND ONE SIDED! You need to look at both sides to be unbiased!

The sad part is I could point out many different videos that have stuff that was played on national news that was overlooked by the average citizen but you guys would say it's a lie, or a conspiracy theory. Anything that doesn't go along with 'We could do no wrong' is wrong in your eyes. I've yet to see either of you actually watch any of the vids I've posted and actually come back with something to debunk it with. Or even to come back with some valid arguments to the points presented in the vids.

But again if your going to debate please take the time to read what I wrote before your start putting words in my mouth. That just makes it a pointless and meaningless debate and I mean that in a freindly way.

[T-Man007]

Re: So sad!

According to many many people I know that have served in Iraq it's a total different story!

Plus of course it was a unrealistic hypothetical. The point was to show you how you put yourself in other peoples shoes. Doing that is what helps people make good decisions. You need to ask yourself how you would feel if you were in their situation, WITHOUT being biased to your own western beliefs.

Anytime I do anything I always try to think like the other person to see how I would feel.

Man if you really do think this has nothing to do with Oil then you need to start doing more research. Even the people on the opposite side of the fence from my belief admit it's about oil in the documentaries I watch. Some of them even go as far as to say "Wouldn't you give a few american lives for some oil?!" That's the type of stuff that enrages me! So many are willing to turn a cheek if it means filling thier pockets.

You might be wise Tmann......But like my sig says, "True wisdom is knowing that you know nothing!" And that is why I continue to do research. There is so much I don't know. You should do the same if your so passionate about your country.

Well, I too know a lot of guys in Iraq, there are 5 military instalations in my home town, so I know a hell of a lot of them and not one gives the version of the story you do. Sorry, but that's the result of my research. So, just because my research doesn't add up to yours doesn't mean I'm not doing it. The difference is this, you intentionally look for the wrong is what is being done, therefore, you overlook that which is truth. I seek the truth and consider all evidence, not opinions, evidence. I never said it has nothing to do with oil, I said you were wrong in stating we are stealing it, which is you are. Stealing is taking without permission...do you think there are American oil companies over in Iraq right now harvestign all the oil just for us? LOL Well, I hope not, because it is a fact that Iraq is in contorl of their own oil. There are no American oil companies over there 'stealing' their oil. Just because I don't buy into your beliefs doesn't make me any less pationate about my country, but I love the way you always do that. Your stance is simple, agree with you are we are not patriots. LOL That's just a bunch of crap. I can be a patriot and not agree with you, you do realize that, right? I don't know, maybe you don't, maybe your only deffinition of a patriot is someone who defies the government, because that seems to be what you think. Anyone who stands up against the government is a patriot to you. It doesn't matter to me, I know what I believe and I know what I feel for this country so whatever you 'think' I feel, it's wrong, because only I know what I feel for this country.

[Waterboy]

Re: So sad!

Would you please provide some links or sites to the documentaries you describe above?
I would like to read them and have a chance to respond.

[DJDIGGLER]

Re: So sad!

Well, I too know a lot of guys in Iraq, there are 5 military instalations in my home town, so I know a hell of a lot of them and not one gives the version of the story you do. Sorry, but that's the result of my research. So, just because my research doesn't add up to yours doesn't mean I'm not doing it. The difference is this, you intentionally look for the wrong is what is being done, therefore, you overlook that which is truth. I seek the truth and consider all evidence, not opinions, evidence. I never said it has nothing to do with oil, I said you were wrong in stating we are stealing it, which is you are. Stealing is taking without permission...do you think there are American oil companies over in Iraq right now harvestign all the oil just for us? LOL Well, I hope not, because it is a fact that Iraq is in contorl of their own oil. There are no American oil companies over there 'stealing' their oil. Just because I don't buy into your beliefs doesn't make me any less pationate about my country, but I love the way you always do that. Your stance is simple, agree with you are we are not patriots. LOL That's just a bunch of crap. I can be a patriot and not agree with you, you do realize that, right? I don't know, maybe you don't, maybe your only deffinition of a patriot is someone who defies the government, because that seems to be what you think. Anyone who stands up against the government is a patriot to you. It doesn't matter to me, I know what I believe and I know what I feel for this country so whatever you 'think' I feel, it's wrong, because only I know what I feel for this country.

I said not doing research is unpatriotic. Not knowing what's going on around you. Not questioning your government. That's what our forefathers would have wanted! I never said you are unpatriotic because of your beliefs.

[DJDIGGLER]

Re: So sad!

Would you please provide some links or sites to the documentaries you describe above?
I would like to read them and have a chance to respond.

Right in my sig. Click away.............

[DJDIGGLER]

Re: So sad!

Would you please provide some links or sites to the documentaries you describe above?
I would like to read them and have a chance to respond.

if you do take the time to watch the whole thing I would 100% respect you. Not that you care if I respect you, but many people watch 10 minutes then start spewing at the mouth like they watched the whole thing. If you watch the whole thing and have good rebuttals I would honestly be interested to see what rebuttals you'd come up with.

[JsJs24]

Re: So sad!

DJDIGGLER you should really consider appreciating what our soldiers are doing. I understand that you don't agree with the reasons we are there, however, our men and women in the military have to be there and defend themselves in those situations. It is easy for someone like yourself to say hide and take cover until you know who is shooting at you, yet that is not always possible. When someone starts firing they must react and react with haste. It is a shame to have so many people that support the other side. I feel like half of this country does not support our own troops. It is also a shame that so many people think they know more than the commanders who are in charge of this war. Everybody becomes and expert all the sudden.

[JsJs24]

Re: So sad!

I read the clip DJ, and once again the media will cause more U.S. soldiers to lose their lives. It is a shame that the media is allowed to be present over there. So many americans choose to believe everything they hear from the other side. Afghanistan should be glad that we are over there helping them. Every time the media portrays an event in a negative manner it leads to hostility which leads to U.S. deaths. I was in Iraq when the prison scandal was made public. The number of attacks increased significantly, not a nice time. The media needs to keep that stuff quiet and let the courts deal with it.

[T-Man007]

Re: So sad!

I read the clip DJ, and once again the media will cause more U.S. soldiers to lose their lives. It is a shame that the media is allowed to be present over there. So many americans choose to believe everything they hear from the other side. Afghanistan should be glad that we are over there helping them. Every time the media portrays an event in a negative manner it leads to hostility which leads to U.S. deaths. I was in Iraq when the prison scandal was made public. The number of attacks increased significantly, not a nice time. The media needs to keep that stuff quiet and let the courts deal with it.

Now you see, THAT is the same version I hear from ALL the soldiers I've met. Once again, I have yet to hear one soldier with different versions.

And to comment on the support of our troops, there are so many people in this country who would rather point fingers at our troops than support them. Yet, they don't actually have teh balls to actually be one. Now for me, I could not have been one even if I wanted to due to my criminal record so I don't want to hear any crap about why I'm not fighting! It's simple, the military doesn't welcome people who have made the mistakes I did. Period. Yet, so many people think they know how our soldiers should act. Phuk that! Go over there and have the guys right next to you blown up with a mortar and tell me how you would feel. One of my best friends has some of the most grusome stories from over there. His team does convoy and transportation secruity, so you can just imagine the attackes they take. This guy has seem his own men blow to piece right in front of him, yet peopel in this country think he should what...stop...take inventory....analyze the area....phuk that...you blow up everything that could be close enough to blow you up, end of story! Those guys are fighting for people who could care less about them, so the only thing they have to keep themselves alive is them, that's it. You do what it takes to stay alive. It's sad that some civilians get caught up in it, but if the terrorist were real men and attacked like men of honor, there wouldn't be so much innocent death. And lets not forget, all the thousands of innocent Iraqis who have been kidnapped and slaughtered because they don't oppose America...oops...were aren't supposed to talk about that....it's ok for those sicko sons of *****es to kill their own women and children. No one wants to talk about the mass killings done by the insurgents....oh no....we only want to talk about the few people killed by American soldiers trying to save their own lives in a country where the people could care less.