Japan`s Military

[pigmeat]

Re: Japan`s Military

Explain your statements further. I don`t understand.
North Korea would stomp us... how exactly?

Red flag is where the best of the best in Air forces from all over the world come to train and have very realistic WAR time, air to air and air to ground combat...they are put to the test against the best us pilots who are trained to fly and fight like mig fighters.....most us bases, and friendly nations attend.....and like i said.japan didnt impress any body with their so called air force.
Why would North korea stomp you....because they are a nation ready to fight, and japan isnt....NK wouldnt be a pushover for any country....including the US. The only way japan would not be demolished is if the US bailed them out, which i wouldnt agree with....they want the war, let them fight it!

[pigmeat]

Re: Japan`s Military

Wow Rage that was an ignorant post!

there are no ignorant posts in here except those that involve flaming members......this forum is to post your oppinions on politics and religion....both touchy subjects......subjects that are more oppinion than fact in most cases....so no...it was not an ignorant post!

[DJDIGGLER]

Re: Japan`s Military

there are no ignorant posts in here except those that involve flaming members......this forum is to post your oppinions on politics and religion....both touchy subjects......subjects that are more oppinion than fact in most cases....so no...it was not an ignorant post!

Maybe you need to go back and read his post then. he was insulting this guys country in a defamatory way. Go back and read. I agree political debates get heated but there's no reason to say they are small and afraid to fight. Obviously they showed us 'no fear' with their kamikazee fighters.

But then again Pigmeat of course you'd jump in on his behalf since your beliefs are partial to his. How about an unbiased mod's opinion.

[Fit2bLarge]

Re: Japan`s Military

I agree with Pigmeat, we can all have healthy discussions without flaming or getting personal.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion - lets just keep it above the belt

[pigmeat]

Re: Japan`s Military

Maybe you need to go back and read his post then. he was insulting this guys country in a defamatory way. Go back and read. I agree political debates get heated but there's no reason to say they are small and afraid to fight. Obviously they showed us 'no fear' with their kamikazee fighters.

But then again Pigmeat of course you'd jump in on his behalf since your beliefs are partial to his. How about an unbiased mod's opinion.

Just because i feel that North korea would wipe japan off the map makes my oppinion biased? I dont think so...keep it clean, this is the last warning...period!

[Rage]

Re: Japan`s Military

Rage, I`d like to repily to your post but your too stupid to understand.

Look punk, if you want to debate military issues, come correct or don`t come at all.

Whoa, calm down Superdog. Are you having a roid rage? I thought this forum was for political debate but your above comments could only be classified as an "ad hominem." An ad hominem argument, also known as argumentum ad hominem (Latin, literally "argument against the person") or attacking the messenger, involves replying to an argument or assertion by attacking the person presenting the argument or assertion rather than the argument itself. It is usually, though not always, a logical fallacy.

Thanks Pigmeat and Fit2belarge for discouraging the flaming. It's nice to know there is a no flaming policy here.

Superdog and DJDiggler, can't we get along with different opinions? No grudges on my end!

[superdog]

Re: Japan`s Military

Well Mr. Rage asking me about roid rage isn`t a little impolite then isn`t it? YOur repily to my post was totally rude and full of mistakes I might add.

Full if generalizations "the japanese are a bunch of wussies", "the Japanese have no will to fight", "the Japanese this that blah blah..."

Do you know every person in this country?

No really, I`ve asked you to clarifiy your experience and explain what makes you qualified to be knowledgeable on this issue but you haven`t.

Shall I outline your mistakes one by one?
"The f-2 a.k.a. F-16"
Totally out of touch with the reality of the airplaine, my suggestion is to go back to the link I posted and have a look.

"Yes, technically Japan is #2 in spending but I think that includes how much they pay the U.S. to stay based in Japan (NO IT DOESNT) and of couse it includes the high costs of real estate for their bases. (WRONG AGAIN) In terms of fighting men and equipment they are no #2! Not even top 10!"

The #2 figure is based on annual expendatures by the government on it`s military. Not outflows to other nations for reparations, etc. The only thing that the US is getting over here is free land and free electricity. Actually the payments are going the other way in Okinawa where the US is paying the Japanese to maintain bombing ranges.

"I would guess that they are spending it on the rent of their military bases"

Rage, why in the world would the Japanese government pay itself to rent land from itself?

" I would go further to say they are small and afraid to fight. "

How can I debate this generalization? Are you psychic? You can see into the mind of every fighting trooper in the JSDF. COMMENTS LIKE THIS ARE INSULTS NOT DEBATE POINTS.

"The Japanese navy scares nobody. North Korean gunboats humiliate the Japanese Navy routinely. (NOT TRUE, WHEN AND WHERE RAGE? YOU NEED TO BACK UP YOUR STATEMENTS WITH EVIDENCE) When Japanese destroyers order North Koreans out of Japanese territory the North Koreans ignore them. (WHEN?) I have even read (WHICH I FIND SUPRISING) a newspaper article where North Korea fired upon a Japanese ship and the Japanese ship didn't even return fire!(POST UP THE ARTICLE RAGE, LET`S SEE YOUR EVIDENCE) They are under strict orders not to confront the North Koreans. If a North Korean ship fires at a Japanese ship and then casually proceeds toward international waters, the Japanese ship will do nothing! "

You are incorrect. The Japanese have sunk several boats in the last 5 years that I`ve lived here. The last one fired a couple of RPGs and got it`s ass blasted with 47mm cannon. I saw the footage, awesome stuff.
AND I REALLY LOVE THE WAY THAT YOU PUT THE ANAL SMILIEY FACE IN YOUR QUOTE, THAT`S NOT FLAMING AT ALL, JUST A RESPECTFULL DEBATE TATIC.


"That's funny, Superdog! Hehehehe. So the newspapers and CNN are in on the conspiracy of hiding the great current Japanese military?(NOW YOU JUST ATTACK ME INSTEAD OF ATTACKING MY POINT, INTERESTING....) Is the Japanese military out spreading a dis-information campaign? Hehehehe. Gotta give you a point for that argument! (AGAIN, GETTING PERSONAL BUT NOT TOUCHING MY POINT)

Hey, I don't mean to be offensive so I hope I wasn't!(YOU WERE TOTALLY OFFENSIVE, DON`T GIVE ME YOUR FALSE APOLOGY) Superdog, you have some interesting ideas and I enjoyed reading them. I just think Japan has really lost the bushido ways of the past. (WHICH IS EVIDENCED BY WHAT? YOU HAVE TO SUPPORT YOUR ARGUMENTS WITH FACTS: I`D COUNTER THAT THE BUSHIDO SPIRIT STILL LIVES AND IS FOUND IN 12 YR OLD BOYS WHO DURING JUDO MATCHES GET THEIR ARMS BROKEN BECAUSE THEY REFUSE THE SHAME OF TAPPING OUT WHEN THE OPPONENT HAS AN ARM LOCK ON THEM. AND YES I`VE SEEN IT HAPPEN) They've really become a nation of wussies. (SIMPLE INSULT, NO COMMENT NECESSARY) America and Japan would both benefit by Japan truly strengthening its military just like Mishima Yukio called for in the 70s. But Mishima was laughed at and forced to commit sepuku because bushido is history.

And one last note-if war breaks out in Japan, Tokyo is dead so I hope you can get out fast, Superdog!
YOU NEVER ANSWERED MY QUESTION RAGE. HOW IS WAR GOING TO BREAK OUT IN TOKYO? ARE THE NORTH KOREANS GOING TO SWIM HERE? WHERE IS THE AMPHIBOUS CAPABABILITY?





So I hope I`ve demonstrated to everyone that Rage`s repily to my post was very insulting, full of generalizations and lacking on factual detail. If Rage has the time to gather his evidence and present points and counterpoints backed by evidence rather than rumor or heresay then I`ll be happy to debate this further. But if this is only going to degrade to further insults and misstatements then I`m not interested.
__________________

[Rage]

Re: Japan`s Military

So I hope I`ve demonstrated to everyone that Rage`s repily to my post was very insulting, full of generalizations and lacking on factual detail. If Rage has the time to gather his evidence and present points and counterpoints backed by evidence rather than rumor or heresay then I`ll be happy to debate this further. But if this is only going to degrade to further insults and misstatements then I`m not interested.

Superdog, I never insulted you, unless by insulting Japan's military readiness reflects on you somehow. I DID laugh at your conspiracy theory that CNN and the newspapers could not be believed when they report that Japan's military is weak. But I laughed at that with a friendly icon in the hopes that you could see it was a joke in good spirit.

Most of what I have stated about Japan's military can be found by searching the following online sources:

Washington Post
NY Times
Japan Times
Daily Yomiuri
Asahi Shimbun

However, I think I'm done with this thread at least for now. I'm not going to look all those up just be called a retard for my efforts. You go ahead and hold onto your beliefs about Japan. They sound sacrosanct and I don't want to piss you off any more since that was never my intention.

Oh, and if you really need to know my education since you have asked what my "qualifications" are now twice I will just tell you that I have graduate degrees and I worked with the Japanese government for three years in Japan.

[pigmeat]

Re: Japan`s Military

Govt issues, especially dealing with war, are 2 sided. You can turn on cnn and here 10 diffrent retired us military generals tell you diff things. One will come on and say that iraq could give us a fight for 20 years...they are this and that and so on....the next will come on and say that the US will demolish them in 2 minutes.......ITS OPPINION PEOPLE!!!!!! ITS LIKE FORD VS CHEVY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You can show the data that ford has more horse power, more payload,YADAYADAYADA!!!!!!! But some chevy fan will still argue that Chevys are better...........

[DJDIGGLER]

Re: Japan`s Military

Govt issues, especially dealing with war, are 2 sided. You can turn on cnn and here 10 diffrent retired us military generals tell you diff things. One will come on and say that iraq could give us a fight for 20 years...they are this and that and so on....the next will come on and say that the US will demolish them in 2 minutes.......ITS OPPINION PEOPLE!!!!!! ITS LIKE FORD VS CHEVY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You can show the data that ford has more horse power, more payload,YADAYADAYADA!!!!!!! But some chevy fan will still argue that Chevys are better...........

Chevy's are better!

[superdog]

Re: Japan`s Military

Most of what I have stated about Japan's military can be found by searching the following online sources:

Washington Post
NY Times
Japan Times
Daily Yomiuri
Asahi Shimbun


Oh, and if you really need to know my education since you have asked what my "qualifications" are now twice I will just tell you that I have graduate degrees and I worked with the Japanese government for three years in Japan.

Rage, I`m sorry it is not my responcibility to research your opinions. If you can not present hard numbers and facts then I can`t take your opinions as anything factual.

As a person with graduate degrees, I`m sure you understand. You must always be prepared to argue your opinion with facts and demonstrate where those facts come from.

Hmm, you worked for three years with the government in Japan... sounds like you were an ALT to me which hardly qualifies you as an expert in military affairs. But I`m happy that you had the opportunity to work with the Board of Education as an Assistant Language Teacher, if that`s what "worked with the Japanese government for three years in Japan" means.

But whatever the case I`m still happy that you had a chance to live here, I hope you enjoyed it.

So, shall we go point for point and debate this propperly? I`m happy to open up a new thread so we can have a clean slate from which to work. I found many mistakes in what you wrote and I`m sad that you don`t understand the truth. Also, forgive me if my tone is strong but I can`t tolerate when people make generalizations about another race. It is the precourser to racism, it is how Hezbollah get`s it`s membership rialed up against the US. It isn`t somthing that intelligent Americans should be doing.

[Rage]

Re: Japan`s Military

Hmm, you worked for three years with the government in Japan... sounds like you were an ALT to me which hardly qualifies you as an expert in military affairs. But I`m happy that you had the opportunity to work with the Board of Education as an Assistant Language Teacher, if that`s what "worked with the Japanese government for three years in Japan" means.

Hmmm. It sounds like in your zeal to impune my "qualifications" you may have just slammed your own teaching profession. Is that what this is all about? Feeling inadequate as a teacher? Superdog, teachers are upstanding members of society. You don't need to feel inadequate in any way. And no, my three years in Japan were not as a teacher but I think I have told you enough personal info about me since you are prone to malign me for anything I tell you. I really don't think arguing opinions requires any qualifications other than the rules of logic and decorum.

So, shall we go point for point and debate this propperly? I`m happy to open up a new thread so we can have a clean slate from which to work. I found many mistakes in what you wrote and I`m sad that you don`t understand the truth. Also, forgive me if my tone is strong but I can`t tolerate when people make generalizations about another race. It is the precourser to racism, it is how Hezbollah get`s it`s membership rialed up against the US. It isn`t somthing that intelligent Americans should be doing.

Well I appreciate the conciliatory statement there. Yeah, I might be up for a new thread at some point but right now I'm pretty sick of this. It has been pretty toxic up to this point. I would rather take a break now and maybe start over again after a few week's moratorium.

[superdog]

Re: Japan`s Military

Rage you can say whatever you want but the fact still remains.

I have presented evidence that Japan`s Military is armed and prepared for the future.

You have presented nothing but heresay, your personal opinion and rumor to counter my point.

I`ll let FG decide who wins the debate.