Liver Concern and Advise

[skinnyman]

I had posted a thread earlier regarding the results of my bloodwork. Keep in mind i wanted to get bloodwork done as i was cycling to understand how my body reacts. Upon receipt of the automated message from the doc's office, all was great. However, upon receipt of my actual full results, my liver level, AST (SGOT) and ALT (SGPT) were quite high. AST Range is 15-41, my resultas were 116. ALT range is 17-63, my results were 70. Upon questioning this with my primary Doc he basical shrugged it off and said I can get an ultrasound to be safe. Ultrasound came in and all is fine.

However as part of my physically i went to see a cardiologist as heart conditions run in my family. All was fine with the Cardiologist however he expessed a deeper concern on my liver results. I told him all the supplements i take, including caffiene and ephedra but not gear, and asked if that can be causing an issue. He did not know. His concern is now a concern of mine.

I was not on that much gear at the time, 600mg test and 300mg deca/week.

I have to think that, considering all the meds some folks are on and some of the larger cycles that folks are on, their levels must be high as well.

I think it best i come off the cycle, what do you guys think?

For liver support i currently take Liv 52 and Milk Thistle, both at the recommended dose. Should i double the dose?

What other supps do you guys take or what else should i do?

Any help is greatly appreciated.

[skinnyman]

Re: Liver Concern and Advise

Or...maybe the cardiologist's concern is that he did not know what was causing the elevation??

I don't know, just looking for relief..

[FUZO]

Re: Liver Concern and Advise

No do not double the dose. What your taking is fine. Years ago when I was on winny I stayed on it to long and my ast and aly were both in the 700's thats right 700's as god is my witness. They all were freaking out. I told them give it a few days and you will see it go down as I just had stopped when I had to go in the hospital. I was right a few days later back to normal. So its important not to stay on winny or any heavy oral to long and take to much. Try drinking more water.


do you drink take any pain meds they will raise your enzymes. did you drink the night before or take anything heavy right before the test that will have a affect. 116 is high but ive seen worse. the 70 isnt that bad but i'm no doctor.If ya want try ging down on the test to 400mg and then in a month take the test again. But if your taking something else that will hurt your liver you have to tell the doc

[FUZO]

Re: Liver Concern and Advise

Or...maybe the cardiologist's concern is that he did not know what was causing the elevation??

I don't know, just looking for relief..

cardiologists dont know shit about gear usage. I had doctors come in my room like I needed a liver transplant or something there so uneducated about steroids

[skinnyman]

Re: Liver Concern and Advise

No do not double the dose. What your taking is fine. Years ago when I was on winny I stayed on it to long and my ast and aly were both in the 700's thats right 700's as god is my witness. They all were freaking out. I told them give it a few days and you will see it go down as I just had stopped when I had to go in the hospital. I was right a few days later back to normal. So its important not to stay on winny or any heavy oral to long and take to much. Try drinking more water.


do you drink take any pain meds they will raise your enzymes. did you drink the night before or take anything heavy right before the test that will have a affect. 116 is high but ive seen worse. the 70 isnt that bad but i'm no doctor.If ya want try ging down on the test to 400mg and then in a month take the test again. But if your taking something else that will hurt your liver you have to tell the doc

Holy crap 700's..I should be drinking more water anyway as i know i do not get enough. I am not on any pain meds but i had a 4 day weekend of heavy drinking with the bros in Va beach. May be that spiked it.

In speaking to a buddy of mine this morning he actually laughed when i told him my level. He said if it was in the thousands he would worry.

Thanks for your help

[Dzone]

Re: Liver Concern and Advise

Hmmmm sounds like you're going to be fine...Could have been the 4 day bender...Ive seen a guy who's skin turned yellowish orange and his eyballs were solid yellow...He did a year of parabolin (tren)...He recovered and was back cycling within a year.

[FUZO]

Re: Liver Concern and Advise

I ALSO WOULD THINK THAT THE BENDER YOU DID MADE YOUR LIVER ENZYMES GO UP SO I WOULDNT LOWER THE DOSE NOW. JUST GET TESTED IN A MONTH AND DONT DRINK A WEEK BEFORE YOU TAKE THE TEST,YES A WHOLE 7 DAYS AND THEN POST IT UP WHAT THE TEST SAYS. BUT SKINNY I DONT PREACH BUT DRINKING AND GEAR NOT SO GOOD. I WOULDNT EVER TELL ANYONE NOT TO DRINK PLEASE DO IF YA WANT BUT I JUST WANT TO GET MY POINT BY THAT BE CAREFUL WHEN ON GEAR AND DRINKING AND OTHER RECREATIONAL DRUGS

[skinnyman]

Re: Liver Concern and Advise

I ALSO WOULD THINK THAT THE BENDER YOU DID MADE YOUR LIVER ENZYMES GO UP SO I WOULDNT LOWER THE DOSE NOW. JUST GET TESTED IN A MONTH AND DONT DRINK A WEEK BEFORE YOU TAKE THE TEST,YES A WHOLE 7 DAYS AND THEN POST IT UP WHAT THE TEST SAYS. BUT SKINNY I DONT PREACH BUT DRINKING AND GEAR NOT SO GOOD. I WOULDNT EVER TELL ANYONE NOT TO DRINK PLEASE DO IF YA WANT BUT I JUST WANT TO GET MY POINT BY THAT BE CAREFUL WHEN ON GEAR AND DRINKING AND OTHER RECREATIONAL DRUGS

No such thing as preaching as i'm here, along with others, for advise and personal experiences so lay it on.

Defintely agree that gear and alcohol is a very bad combination, even in moderation. I do go long stints without it when cycling but admit on occassion to have a few. Need to eliminate all together.

Outside the Liv 52 and Milk Thistle, what other supps, etc do you folks take?

[BABY1]

Re: Liver Concern and Advise

No such thing as preaching as i'm here, along with others, for advise and personal experiences so lay it on.

Defintely agree that gear and alcohol is a very bad combination, even in moderation. I do go long stints without it when cycling but admit on occassion to have a few. Need to eliminate all together.

Outside the Liv 52 and Milk Thistle, what other supps, etc do you folks take?

I don't have experience in this area, but I do know that if you drink 1 fresh squeezed lemon a day (in a glass of water) it is supposed to help detoxify the body. I have done this and in the beginning I have experienced headaches and I broke out a little. That doesn't last long and it is because the body is ridding toxins. It is also a good diuretic and great for the skin as well as containing vitamin C. It is a natural way to detox. Some take it upon waking in the morning, others take it before bed. Since the body detoxes during sleep, this is why many people believe these times are best. I started out with 1/2 a lemon.

[skinnyman]

Re: Liver Concern and Advise

Baby this is really interesting and there's no reason not to give it a shot.

just checked the refridgerator, no lemons. However do have RealLemon 100% juice.

Gonna start with 3 Tbl spoons of RealLemon in a glass of water.

[millenium girl]

Re: Liver Concern and Advise

Keep us posted, skinnyman. I have liver "pain" since I started the winny cycle but I didn't have any bloodwork done so far.

[skinnyman]

Re: Liver Concern and Advise

I decided to go a different route after doing some research.

Ever here of apple cider vinegar as a "cure all" and detoxifier? It must be the unfiltered, organic type with the "mother" and a ph of 5-7.

Quite nasty to take down but i'm going to give it shot

BTW Baby my research also showed lemons as being a very good detoxifier as well. i decided to go with the apple vinegar because of its other benefits

[BABY1]

Re: Liver Concern and Advise

I decided to go a different route after doing some research.

Ever here of apple cider vinegar as a "cure all" and detoxifier? It must be the unfiltered, organic type with the "mother" and a ph of 5-7.

Quite nasty to take down but i'm going to give it shot

BTW Baby my research also showed lemons as being a very good detoxifier as well. i decided to go with the apple vinegar because of its other benefits

Great! Try it out and see how it works! You can always try the lemons then. There are some side effects one can experience from apple cider vinrgar and I don't think there are sides from lemons. lemons also taste a little better. Let us know how it goes.

Apple cider vinegar is a popular health tonic with many potential benefits.

However, as with many products, there are also some potential side effects that you should be aware of.

The good news is that most apple cider vinegar side effects are mild, and in many cases they can be easily prevented.

Here is what you need to know before you start taking.

Apple Vinegar Side Effects #1:

Weaken Tooth Enamel

Highly acidic drinks like apple cider vinegar can weaken tooth enamel.
To protect yourself, never drink vinegar straight. Dilute it with water to drink it.
After you are finished, get a glass of fresh water and rinse your mouth out to remove the acid from your teeth.
Do not brush your teeth until you have rinsed, as brushing while the vinegar is still on your teeth is more likely to damage the enamel.

Apple Vinegar Side Effects #2:

Burn Skin and Throat

Vinegar has been known to irritate or even burn skin when used at full-strength.
Also, one woman suffered permanent damage to her esophagus after getting an apple cider vinegar tablet stuck in her throat.
To prevent this side effect, always dilute vinegar before drinking it or applying it to skin.
Try to take liquid vinegar drinks instead of pills, and if you do take pills, take them with plenty of water.

Apple Vinegar Side Effects #3:

Lower Potassium and Bone Density

A 1998 case report found that one patient who ingested large amounts of vinegar suffered from low blood potassium levels. As a result, she also suffered from low bone density and osteoporosis.
You should stick to low doses of apple cider vinegar or avoid it altogether if you have osteoporosis or if you are taking medicines that could lower your blood potassium levels.


Apple Vinegar Side Effects #4:

Interact with Drugs

Vinegar may interact with certain drugs.
Talk to your doctor before you start taking apple cider vinegar if you take any of the following medications: digoxin (a heart drug), diuretics like Lasix, prescription laxatives, or if you take insulin.


Apple Vinegar Side Effects #5:

Upset Stomach

Many people use apple cider diluted in water as a tonic for an upset stomach. However, other people have reported apple cider vinegar side effects that include heartburn, diarrhea and indigestion.
Possibly, different people react differently to vinegar based on their different body chemistries.
Since vinegar is commonly used as a detox drink, some people may experience these apple cider vinegar side effects as part of the normal detox process.
However, if these symptoms make you uncomfortable and do not subside over time, try reducing the dose or discontinuing use altogether.