AM dbol

[Fonz]

Go here:

AM Dball Study at AF:

http://www.anabolicfitness.net/library/Morning%20D-Bol%20Study.pdf

Fonz

[Big Cat]

Originally posted by Fonz
Go here:

AM Dball Study at AF:

http://www.anabolicfitness.net/library/Morning%20D-Bol%20Study.pdf

Fonz

Not to burst your bubble, but as Bobo aptly pointed out, any study showing 100 mg/day of dbol for 6 weeks shows no more increase in force over control, considering 3.3 kg of extra muscle loses its credibility like snow under the sun.

[The REAL Bobo]

Originally posted by Fonz
Go here:

AM Dball Study at AF:

http://www.anabolicfitness.net/library/Morning%20D-Bol%20Study.pdf

Fonz

I did already and I found this and posted it above. Am I missing something?




Plasma Testosterone Initial Value 19.6 Final Value 8.1
Plasma LH Initial Value 18.1 Final Value 15.4


Another interesting results of this study stated "the results did not support the belief that anabolic steroids increase strength and performance"


This was d-bol at 100mg/day and the results showed no increase in strenght and performance. Seems a little fishy to me.


This is what your basing your theory on? Looks like testosterone was suppressed to me."


EDIT: Is there anything after 1976 that supports your theory? Not trying to be a smartass but I was just wondering if this is all there is.

[Big Cat]

Take into account this line from the study itself under "results" :

... the precision of this assay, was unusually low ..."

[Fonz]

Originally posted by Big Cat
Layed them all out nice and neat for you. Notice how carefully he sidesteps any substantiation of what he says. Despite the fact that he has the burden of proof, I'm doing most of the work here.

Goind from Cycle to HCG/Nov/Whatever you want = MUSCLE LOSS

I don't care who you are, this will happen.

With the dball bridge, muscle loss will be MUCH smaller.

Then, during your HCG/Nov etc... post-cycle regimen you will pick up fat due to depressed test levels. Not so, with the dball bridge, as you can actually lose a bit of fat.

And Beta agonists catabolic?

ARE YOU NUTS?

Ephedrine increases FFA breakdown via Beta-2 and beta-3 stimulation and favours FAT OXIDATION over glucose oxidation.

There are ZILLIONS of studies showing this.

Clen also. Beta-2's are also involved in protein synthesis, hence why Clen is somehow of an anti-catabolic while it is working.

And now, thanks to animal, the addition of TAURINE to CLEN inhibits the T4-T3 downregulation seen after 2 weeks of Clen,
Therefore letting Clen work FOR LONGER.

I will say this again.

You are WAY BEHIND THE TIMES. Your theories are out-dated.

Just do everybody a favour and stay at CEM.

Fonz

[Fonz]

Originally posted by Big Cat
Take into account this line from the study itself under "results" :

... the precision of this assay, was unusually low ..."

No offense Big Cat, but studies done on Dball just to see if it inhibits a person in the AM aren't exactly plentiful.

And 100mgs?

Give me a break. I even said that was nuts. It has to be 10mg. End of story.

You have to rely on REAL blood tests and endocrinological theory
in order to prove the AM dball theory.

Funny thing is, there's a lot of people for WHOM IT WORKS.

Whits that?

AN aberration?lol

You crack me up Big Cat.

You go from PH's to AAS and suddenly you're a Guru...lol

What a joke.

Fonz

[The REAL Bobo]

Originally posted by Fonz
No offense Big Cat, but studies done on Dball just to see if it inhibits a person in the AM aren't exactly plentiful.

And 100mgs?

Give me a break. I even said that was nuts. It has to be 10mg. End of story.

You have to rely on REAL blood tests and endocrinological theory
in order to prove the AM dball theory.

Funny thing is, there's a lot of people for WHOM IT WORKS.

Whits that?

AN aberration?lol

You crack me up Big Cat.

You go from PH's to AAS and suddenly you're a Guru...lol

What a joke.

Fonz

No offense bro, but you seem to forgetting that at 100mg/day they found that there was not an increase in strength or performance. Are you going to tell me now that D-bol doesn't increase strength and performance? In other words, the study seems EXTREMELY flawed.

[Big Cat]

Originally posted by Fonz
Goind from Cycle to HCG/Nov/Whatever you want = MUSCLE LOSS

How ?

With the dball bridge, muscle loss will be MUCH smaller.

By prolonging recovery time you expose people to more catabolic conditions (level of androgens exponentially lower), leaving them with an equal time of recovery afterwards.

Then, during your HCG/Nov etc... post-cycle regimen you will pick up fat due to depressed test levels. Not so, with the dball bridge, as you can actually lose a bit of fat.

Exactly : GAINING fat = ANABOLIC. Losing fat = CATABOLIC. In fact that is the essence of those two words. Gaining and losing.

And Beta agonists catabolic?

ARE YOU NUTS?

Ephedrine increases FFA breakdown via Beta-2 and beta-3 stimulation and favours FAT OXIDATION over glucose oxidation.

Here is one to ponder for you : OXIDATION. that means catabolic.
Secondly, and I'm gonna have a field day with this statement, it favours glucose oxidation since beta-agonists will essentially reverse the process that insulin performs, releasing glycogen as glucose into the blood stream, causing a surge of usable energy in the bloodstream, for, guess what, oxidation. Ever hear of fight or flight ? Cathecholamines ? Well, news for you : beta-agonists baby.

There are ZILLIONS of studies showing this.

Clen also. Beta-2's are also involved in protein synthesis, hence why Clen is somehow of an anti-catabolic while it is working.

And now, thanks to animal, the addition of TAURINE to CLEN inhibits the T4-T3 downregulation seen after 2 weeks of Clen,
Therefore letting Clen work FOR LONGER.

Wow, you really aren't the brightest bulb here are you ? The reason clen stops working is because its too heavy on the beta-2, causing a cascade :

1) retraction of a number of beta-2 receptors to make them less available

2) phosphorylation of inside of receptors to prevent signalling

3) decrease of cAMP and release of AMP by the cell, as an active reduction in second messengers.

That's why clen stops to work, it has nothing to do with T3. And if you wanted to stop the inhibition of T4/T3 conversion, guggul has been shown to do a much better job than taurine. But really you'd do wiser to stick to EC since they inrease noradrenaline, a universal beta-agonist, allowing you to work the beta-3 as well and cause less damage to the beta-2. Save the clen fro the last three weeks.

And to end : clen was only shown to be anti-catabolic in animals, the results were disproven in humans. Theoretically because of a differeing beta-3 receptor, but no actual proof.

You are WAY BEHIND THE TIMES. Your theories are out-dated.

Wow. That's an original one. outdated ? I don't have theories, I bring facts. The fact that your bullshit is nothing but that, bullshit, comes to mind. You obviously don't know the first thing about physiology. i'm just a molecular biologist, an endocrinologist would rip you to shreds.

Just do everybody a favour and stay at CEM.

Thought that was your place mr nuclear physicist. I would be careful about taunting me, I've got more on you than you would want your internet buddies to know.

No, I go from board to board to find stupid theorists who wish they had a degree and prove them wrong, much more fun

[Big Cat]

Originally posted by The REAL Bobo
No offense bro, but you seem to forgetting that at 100mg/day they found that there was not an increase in strength or performance. Are you going to tell me now that D-bol doesn't increase strength and performance? In other words, the study seems EXTREMELY flawed.

If he had half a brain, he would know that if the researchers called it flawed, it is flawed and unreliable. But given that he spends more time blabbing off on boards than actually reading studies, he seems to lack that trait.

[Big Cat]

I'm feeling good ! Got any more ? I was in a bit of a slum, given that its a slow sunday, but I'm all better now.

Its 2.15 in the AM, if I don't answer straight away, I will try to do it as soon as I wake up.

[Fonz]

Originally posted by The REAL Bobo
No offense bro, but you seem to forgetting that at 100mg/day they found that there was not an increase in strength or performance. Are you going to tell me now that D-bol doesn't increase strength and performance? In other words, the study seems EXTREMELY flawed.

Yes, that is true.

But the study is very bare bones.

Doesn't say what he did...weight-wise etc..

Fonz

[Big Cat]

Originally posted by Fonz
Yes, that is true.

But the study is very bare bones.

Doesn't say what he did...weight-wise etc..

Fonz

It was non-sgnificant, and moreover even the researcher commented that his study was less controlled than he would have liked. I'm pretty sure they didn't keep these boys locked up.

[Fonz]

Originally posted by Fonz
Goind from Cycle to HCG/Nov/Whatever you want = MUSCLE LOSS

I don't care who you are, this will happen.

With the dball bridge, muscle loss will be MUCH smaller.

Then, during your HCG/Nov etc... post-cycle regimen you will pick up fat due to depressed test levels. Not so, with the dball bridge, as you can actually lose a bit of fat.

And Beta agonists catabolic?

ARE YOU NUTS?

Ephedrine increases FFA breakdown via Beta-2 and beta-3 stimulation and favours FAT OXIDATION over glucose oxidation.

There are ZILLIONS of studies showing this.

Clen also. Beta-2's are also involved in protein synthesis, hence why Clen is somehow of an anti-catabolic while it is working.

And now, thanks to animal, the addition of TAURINE to CLEN inhibits the T4-T3 downregulation seen after 2 weeks of Clen,
Therefore letting Clen work FOR LONGER.

I will say this again.

You are WAY BEHIND THE TIMES. Your theories are out-dated.

Just do everybody a favour and stay at CEM.

Fonz

Oh, and if you don't waat to use EPH or Clen and concentrate on the nutrient partitioning system: Glucose/Insulin

There's CLA/ALA/ALCar/GLA combination.

This combination will favour fat loss and muscle preservation.

And guess who has done all the research for these combos(Except ALcar...that goes to animal)?

ME.

WTF have you done?

N-O-T-H-I-N-G.

All you do is blab on and on and never have any ideas of your own.

Just go away...you're a joke to me.

Fonz

[Fonz]

Originally posted by Big Cat
It was non-sgnificant, and moreover even the researcher commented that his study was less controlled than he would have liked. I'm pretty sure they didn't keep these boys locked up.

Read my last post.

Fonz

[Big Cat]

Originally posted by Fonz
Oh, and if you don't waat to use EPH or Clen and concentrate on the nutrient partitioning system: Glucose/Insulin

There's CLA/ALA/ALCar/GLA combination.

Actually you are using two insulin sensitivity increasers. As far as fat loss that will have a reverse effect, since insulin does not concern itself with whether it stores in muscles or in adipose tissue.

And guess who has done all the research for these combos(Except ALcar...that goes to animal)?

Only someone with no sense in these matters AT ALL, would use insulin sensitivity increasing agents to lose fat.

ME.

Hey, what do you know, I was right. And you said I couldn't theorize.

WTF have you done?

N-O-T-H-I-N-G.

All you do is blab on and on and never have any ideas of your own.

I just make champions. Damn.

Just go away...you're a joke to me.

I find you quite amusing too. This and the progestin thread have been good for me. Real ego boost. I especially love the way how you start overstating your feeble contributions when you know I kicked your ass. You are hilarious.