Do NOT send me samples!

[Team Flex]

Ok it was me... I did it all Billy.... hehhehe Just joking.... For real though you are da man... Keep posting all your knowledge bro... I have been learning from you as well as others on this board.. Its great...

[hostile]

I am going back to school to take some chemistry. (and I am dead serious). I have been thinking about it for a while to understand what the fuck is going on here and to be able to help more people.

I wonder what my fellow students are going to think when I keep asking specific questions related to steroids. I have already graduated with an MBA, so I really will just be there to learn about steroids.

I don't think I can get in this late in the semester, but I am going to try.

[Billy_Bathgate]

After only 1 class of organic, you will be so amazed of how different you can put things together. IT may breifly touch on steroids, but not much. We had about 3 lecutures worth on them and it didnt go into like tren and deca stuff lol, just test estrogen and..lanastrole...I can never remember that one. Its the parent steroid of all. Its funny though, I asked questions about them before and nobody even thought about putting the 2 and 2 together and hint at me.

Anways, you will get alot of lab work in and making powder and fina kits will be a joke to you! Its definatelly cool stuff. You will see all about this spectrography. Its a little tuff at first, but once you get it down its like cake. GCMS is easy, its the IR and NMR that can be harder.

Advice, study up on your functional groups and get them out of the way. Learn to draw stick diagrams. Youll be ahead of the class then.

[spidey]

Originally posted by Billy_Bathgate
Those were fake BTG's BTW, not pharmacy ones...

But, if any var was in there AT ALL it would have shown. You would have seen a 3rd peak right up the middle around the 9.1-9.2 minute mark. Using that same solvent, and that same gas, Var would always show up at that spot. Reguardless of what else is in it. Thats one of the beauties of it.

Your right though, there are two different compounds. They happen to be the same MW formula, but they were isomers. Now I dont know if they were stereo-isomers (trans- and cis-), optical-isomers (r- and s-), constitutional isomers (different arrangements), or structural isomers (different geometry). I have a feeling they were optical though as they showed up very close on the UV spectra. I bet that is on the 5th page though.

Very unlikely to be optical isomers. To tell the differance between R and S isomers, a chiral column would have to be used, which is much more expensive than most GC columns. The two isomers in the chromatogram are more likely to be stereoisomers of androstendiol; probably epimers at the 17 position.

-Spidey

[Ripped Guinea]

Originally posted by painintheazz
I like you bro, Think you have some very good things to say about chem issues. I have read a lot of your past posts and respect you.

Pain

I agree. You are an asset to all the anabolic boards out there. You provide excellent info to all of us. Don't let someone's ignorant comments get you down. Take a deep breath, inject some test, and take it out on your girlfriends fine ass. That's what i do. Peace.

[Krush]

Just read thread...head throbbing...eyes glazed...need...fina...too much science...ugh!

[hostile]

Originally posted by Billy_Bathgate
After only 1 class of organic, you will be so amazed of how different you can put things together. IT may breifly touch on steroids, but not much. We had about 3 lecutures worth on them and it didnt go into like tren and deca stuff lol, just test estrogen and..lanastrole...I can never remember that one. Its the parent steroid of all. Its funny though, I asked questions about them before and nobody even thought about putting the 2 and 2 together and hint at me.

Anways, you will get alot of lab work in and making powder and fina kits will be a joke to you! Its definatelly cool stuff. You will see all about this spectrography. Its a little tuff at first, but once you get it down its like cake. GCMS is easy, its the IR and NMR that can be harder.

Advice, study up on your functional groups and get them out of the way. Learn to draw stick diagrams. Youll be ahead of the class then.

Thanks bro. I just got my ex-wife's chemistry book down from the shelf. That's about the only thing I got out of the divorce. LOL. And that's just because it was hiding in a box somewhere and I found it years later.

I probably won't be able to get in this semester, but I am going to start reading now.

Maybe I will have to wait until summer to get in the class.

[Billy_Bathgate]

Originally posted by spidey
Very unlikely to be optical isomers. To tell the differance between R and S isomers, a chiral column would have to be used, which is much more expensive than most GC columns. The two isomers in the chromatogram are more likely to be stereoisomers of androstendiol; probably epimers at the 17 position.

-Spidey

Cool thanks! Stereo-isomers would have been my second guess, and now that you said the above, it kinda makes sence. I havent ever ran two r- and s- compounds and been able to compare them so thats a bit new to me. Figuring out where to locate the chiral centers in compounds was one of the harder points for me to pick up. I can visualize things in 3D well, but trying to picture that same object in a mirror and locate what is the exact same was a bit harder


teekahty- my freshman year before I took organic I had to take a chemical engineering class called materials. It was kinda the chemisty of metals and crystaline structures. Anyways, I used the gum ball toothpick method to help visualice the lattice structures. It was cool! Hard to do with the molecular set.


Wow, thanks for all the compliments though guys. I never was upset by the comment that inparticular people made (not basskiller or any of you guys), I just didnt want the wrong impression of my comments to be taken though.

I love the chemisty side of AS. For somer eason, although perhaps nerdy, it just seems kinda fun to me. And I am glad to help out any of those that I may!

[LOCO]

Originally posted by teekahty
ROCK ON MY GEEKY BRUTHA

[Billy_Bathgate]

Any time bro!

Did you see what superchicken wrote though? I wasnt sure if the memo was in respect to the customer or another lab worker, but it appears it was from the customers request.

guys i rmember when that lab test was in progress.

what that lab was doing was they used a diff method of testing the first time, and the var came back as real. customer and someone else disputed and said no way its gotta be fake, so the lab restested using a diff method(which takes them more time so they usually dont do it) and then they found out it was fake. the second method is the gcms that was posted here.

[BIG_GUNS_21]

List me

[Billy_Bathgate]

Ya maybe so BK, Im not as familiar with top level labs like that. Thats why I was curious about it. I just know its the standard that we use. I was pretty sure though that on some other lab test I have seen they list the type of test as gas chromatography GS which would be the same type of test. Maybe they just dont bother printing it all out or something?

Now the second test they ran a UV on it, which I doubt they would do unless it was specifically requested reguarding a discrepancy. But I wonder now, who decides that discrepancy, the customer or the lab worker? If its the customer, how would they ever know without the GCMS report?

Im kinda suprised this hasnt ever been asked before. I know most of us dont exactly care about chemistry, but there are a few bros on here that are in that field.

It is easy to run, but it takes about an hour to run it.

[Billy_Bathgate]

I reread the memo on the first lab sheet. It looks like they did the standard GCMS on it to begin with. I think the customer then complained and they went back and relooked at it (they mention that the second peak was close so they assumed it was actually VAR to start with)...

Then the performed the extra test which showed it wasnt, but instead Andro.


I wish we had the very orignial report cause I wonder if they reported it as 20.8mg/ml or like 4mg/ml with an unknown compound also present. Or if they reported it as 0mg/ml. I think I would have to assume they didnt include the GCMS data sheet with the original either.

Maybe we should ask for them with the future labs? All they have to do is hit print.

[HeHateMe]

hey bro, if i send you a specimen sample could you analyze it and let me know if my sperm count is up to par??? ...LoL...seriously tho, to echo the sentiments of the others, you are definitely a real asset to the board...you definitely know your stuff

[Small]

So, can I have my samples back, then?

j/k