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  • Glutamine (From FAQ)

    Got this from the supplement forum's FAQ. This is very inaccurate information, I will break it down....



    2. What does it do and what scientific studies give evidence to support this?

    Glutamine is highly in demand throughout the body. It is used in the gut and immune system extensively to maintain optimal performance. 60% of free-form amino acids floating in skeletal muscles is L-glutamine. L-glutamine plays a very important role in protein metabolism, and it appears to be a very important nutrient for body builders. When supplemented, it may help body builders reduce the amount of muscle deterioration that occurs because other tissues that need glutamine will not rob the glutamine stored in the muscle cells.
    From a study done, glutamine was proven worthless orally in weight training, heres the conclusion:

    We conclude that glutamine supplementation during resistance training has no significant effect on muscle performance, body composition or muscle protein degradation in young healthy adults. (1)

    *(1) Effect of glutamine supplementation combined with resistance training in young adults.
    Candow DG, Chilibeck PD, Burke DG, Davison KS, Smith-Palmer T.
    College of Kinesiology, University of Saskatchewan, Saskatoon, Canada.

    Glutamine is indeed the most abundant free-form amino acid in the body. So abundant in fact, it would take 6 days of intense weight training and 5 days of intense (HIIT style) cardio to deplete basal glutamine levels enough to need outside supplement. The body will not use supplemented glutamine unless its own stores are drastically depleted. Glutamine also will not absorb in a high caloric diet, i.e. bulking.



    Research shows that after intensely working out, glutamine levels in the body are reduced by as much as 50%. Since the body relies on glutamine as cellular fuel for the immune system, scientific studies have shown that glutamine supplementation can minimize the breakdown of muscle tissue and improve protein metabolism.
    Not exactly. I would like a reference to show that glutamine is depleted by 50%, Im not sure this is accurate. None the less, almost every protein powder contains a nice amino acid profile, including a good amount of glutamine, so you're already restoring basal levels, not to mention if you eat dairy products, beans, etc. you're also building stores back up, so hyw pay $40 for 400 grams?

    Also, glutamine has no effect on protein synthesis, as proven from this statement from a PubMed study:

    We conclude that intravenous infusion of amino acids increases the fractional rate of mixed muscle protein synthesis, but addition of glutamine to the amino acid mixture does not further stimulate muscle protein synthesis rate in healthy young men and women. (2)

    (2) Metabolism 2000 Dec;49(12):1555-60 Related Articles, Links

    Intravenous glutamine does not stimulate mixed muscle protein synthesis in healthy young men and women.
    Zachwieja JJ, Witt TL, Yarasheski KE.
    Exercise and Nutrition Program, Pennington Biomedical Research Center, Baton Rouge, LA, USA.

    Before you say "glutamine is taken orally, not intravenous, think about it, ah yes, intravenous would prove glutamine even more potent in the body and it still fails the test.


    Its effects on replenishing the body after stress or trauma have been shown in Europe where it is commonly given to patients in hospitals.
    Ah yes, the stress factor... glutamine has no physiological effect on the human bodies immune system, as provided in this statement:


    It is concluded that, although the glutamine hypothesis may explain immunodepression related to other stressful conditions such as trauma and burn, plasma glutamine concentration is not likely to play a mechanistic role in exercise-induced immunodepression.
    (3)

    And this one..:

    This study does not support that postexercise decrease in salivary IgA is related to plasma glutamine concentrations (4)

    (3) J Appl Physiol 2002 Sep;93(3):813-22 Related Articles, Links
    Exercise-induced immunodepression- plasma glutamine is not the link.
    Hiscock N, Pedersen BK.
    Copenhagen Muscle Research Centre and Department of Infectious Diseases, Rigshospitalet, University of Copenhagen, DK-2100 Copenhagen, Denmark.

    (4) Effect of glutamine and protein supplementation on exercise-induced decreases in salivary IgA.
    Krzywkowski K, Petersen EW, Ostrowski K, Link-Amster H, Boza J, Halkjaer-Kristensen J, Pedersen BK.
    The Copenhagen Muscle Research Centre, Rigshospitalet, 2200 Copenhagen, Denmark.


    Glutamine's cell-volumizing effects have also been shown in several studies.
    Lets see these studies?

    Anyway, the majority of the 'cell volumizing effects' comes from glycogen replacement in the muscle belly, which is dismissed here:

    It is concluded that ingestion of a glutamine/carbohydrate mixture does not increase the rate of glycogen resynthesis in muscle. (5)

    (5) Int J Sports Med 2000 Jan;21(1):25-30 Related Articles, Links
    The effect of free glutamine and peptide ingestion on the rate of muscle glycogen resynthesis in man.
    van Hall G, Saris WH, van de Schoor PA, Wagenmakers AJ.
    Department of Human Biology, Maastricht University, The Netherlands. RH01769@RH.DK

    No conclusive studies have been done to evaluate the effects of L-glutamine supplementation on weight-training adults; however, a recent study showed up to a 400% increase in growth-hormone levels when as little as 2 grams of free-form L-glutamine supplement was consumed!
    Actually they have, see above. This is obvious from a supplement company attempting to pimp glutamine. God forbid mention that it was worthless to weight training athletes, then no one would buy it. Its rare to find a study, if ever, to support glutamine as a positive factor on the body, and all you can find is articles and 99% of these are written or funded by supplement companines, who inevitably are insure the article is pro-glutamine.


    3. Who needs it and what are some symptoms of deficiency?


    Bodybuilders and those who have been under a lot of stress or trauma (such as burn, surgery, and disease victims) can particularly gain from the intake of glutamine. Since bodybuilders use a lot of their glutamine when working out, they are more susceptible to illness, as the immune system relies heavily on this amino acid.
    But you just said there was no link to glutamine needed for weight training athletes? Vitamin C boosts the immune system too and its 100x's cheaper and it really boosts the immunse system.

    Becoming ill or losing lean muscle mass are signs of deficiency. Catabolism or muscle break down can occur if the body robs muscles of glutamine for use elsewhere such as nitrogen transport or maintaining the immune system. Glutamine supplementation is certainly important in keeping muscles building--not deteriorating.
    More of a sign and symptom of not enough protein. Catabolism occurs when the body has to use amino acids for energy, via breakdown of lean muscle tissue. This is generally in extreme cases, when glycogen is fully delpleted and fat stores are SO low that they refuse to release triglycerides for energy production. These guys make glutamine out to be comparable to protein, lame.


    4. How much should be taken? Are there any side effects?


    Bodybuilders can benefit by taking ten grams of L-glutamine per day, although clinical studies have not determined a precise amount for muscle metabolism optimization.
    10 grams and 9.5 of that is pissed out within hours. No clinical studies have determined anything pro-glutamine.



    Glutamic Acid
    We primarily obtain glutamine from the conversion of glutamic acid from food, although some is also found in food. The average amount supplied from a healthy diet is 5-8 grams per day.
    A healthy diet for whom? I eat a healthy diet of around 4K calories a day, Im sure thats well above average, and sinc ethis article refused to lay out what was average, this is a null statement. Im sure I get around 20 grams of glutamine, naturally each day, which is more than enough, not to mention real food is cheaper.


    Among medical practitioners who use blood tests to determine amino acid status, glutamine is one that is often found to be lacking, especially in patients with either chronic illness or mood and cognitive symptoms.
    Study to back this up please? Holy shit! they're ill! No wonder! they're also lacking water, glycogen, vitamins and minerals, most everything.



    For this reason glutamine has become extremely popular, not just with athletes, but among holistic medical practitioners who use it in the treatment of a wide variety of ailments. Glutamine in muscle is a regulator of muscle protein synthesis or muscle building and supports muscle glycogen accumulation. When there is glutamine depletion, there is a breakdown in muscle. Studies indicate glutamine counteracts cortisone steroid induced muscle atrophy.
    This is a repost, just reworded from above. Glutamine has no effects on protein synthesis, see above. When there is protein depletion, muscle breaksdown.Glutamine counteracts cortisol because of its insulin releasing factors, insulin naturally suppresses cortisol, so why not carb up pre workout? Whey protein also spikes insulin to suppress cortisol. Vitamin C is one of the major factors in cortisol suppression. This is a very inaccurate, vague article.

    Skeletal muscle in the body accounts for approximately 30-40% of the total body mass. A 150 lb male would ideally have about 60 grams of glutamine in these muscles. Free stores of glutamine in muscles exceed those of any other amino acid. Surgical and injury trauma, infections, burns, stress, cancer, and most major illnesses dramatically deplete and alter the production and flow of glutamine causing movement of glutamine out of the muscle and decreasing glutamine blood levels.
    Reference please? Once again, Surgical and injury trauma, infections, burns, stress, cancer, and most major illnesses dramatically decrease EVERYTHING in the body. Geez.


    Under these circumstances the net glutamine consumption exceeds the production and there is a decrease in muscle protein synthesis. This contributes to the muscle wasting seen in severe illness and trauma and can also happen with intense exercise.
    Actually no, the glutamine effecting protein synthesis was dismissed above, this is the 3rd time this article mentions this right? weak. Not to mention it already said no studies have been done to see reason to take glutmaine orally for weight lifting athletes.

    Research has shown a significant correlation between survival in severely infected patients and the muscle glutamine concentration. Supplying glutamine helps the metabolic processes associated with recovery. So as an athlete glutamine can help you in the following areas:
    Well let's see this research? Nevermind, it doesnt exist.


    Stimulates muscle protein synthesis by donating nitrogen to build proteins.
    4th time, dismissed above.

    Increases growth hormone which can induce positive body composition and mood changes (Note: A study done in 1995 by LSU College of Medicine showed that a surprisingly small oral dose of 2 grams of glutamine raised GH levels more than 4X over that of a placebo. Age did not diminish the response of the volunteers who ranged in age from 32 to 64 years.)
    Sure it did, wheres the article? 1995? That's 8 years ago my man, new research is done everyday. So what about guys around say...24? how does it effect us? weak.

    Decreases muscle catabolism during exercise
    Increases endurance by replenishing glycogen under conditions of glycogen depletion
    Decreases muscle recovery time
    Decreases the chances of illness/infection by boosting your immune system

    All dismissed above.

    Prevents over-training from high loads and long duration activities (recall that blood glutamine levels are an excellent marker of anabolic status).
    Prevents over training? So I can do chest every other day and not be over training? Need to be more specific. Who wrote this? I want to e-mail them. The only thing to prevent over training is to not over train in your workout routine, duh.


    Improves And Stabilizes Blood Sugar

    Glutamine does this through several mechanisms. When the blood sugar is low, glutamine suppresses insulin to stop the further decline of the sugar levels. It also stimulates glycogen to be released to help increase the blood sugar to normal levels. Further, glutamine is a glycogenic amino acid which means it can convert to sugar for energy production, a process called gluconeogenesis.
    Wait, it said above that it suppressed cortisol via insulin spike. wtf? Change your mind? Once again, any relation to glycogen is dismissed. Yes, it can convert to glucogen via the Cory cycle, but if you dont burn it up, guess what? yep, does as any carb would do and sotres as fat, so thats more glycogen you have to burn if you over do the glutamine, and if you're cutting, which is when glutamine is used the most, thats more glycogen you have to burn to get to that fat store, so glutaminei s actually worthless when cutting,



    Decreases Alcohol And Sugar Cravings

    The blood sugar stabilizing effects may partly explain why it decreases sugar and alcohol cravings. In studies with alcoholics, 2 to 3 grams given 3 times daily decreased the desire to drink, decreased anxiety, and improved sleep. It works best given between meals. Giving glutamine to rats decreased their voluntary alcohol consumption by 34%. When the glutamine was stopped their alcohol consumption returned to baseline levels.
    Wtf? This isnt of any relevance to bodybuilding, other than when cutting to prevent sugar cravings, but when you have to take that much, it just converts to glucose (sugar), so whats the point?


    Maintains Health And Function Of The Lining Of The Gut

    Due to the frequency and volume that most athletes consume food they put a heck of a lot of stress on the digestive system and glutamine can help ensure everything is functioning properly here. Many medical professionals believe that most chronic diseases originate from the gut. The problem starts when, for a variety of reasons, the lining of the gut becomes leaky, which allows pathogens, food particles, bacteria, fungi, and parasites into general circulation where they can cause problems such as autoimmune diseases, food allergies, and a host of other chronic ailments.
    Funny, so does milk, cottage cheese and protein powder. This is a very weak article, not much trouble picking this one apart, jsut another expample as to why glutamine is worthless.

  • #2
    When you no longer take or get any protein in your diet. Then I will believe you. Until then it's still protein and will be needed to build muscle. Why don't you prove you case and remove all of glutamine from your body and leave a note on your dead body saying that glutamine is worthless.
    Facts are that both groups still got glutamine in their diet. Only one group got some extra glutamine and the other group got some extra sugar which both are needed to build muscle.
    In fact that study you like to quote didn't prove a damm thing.
    no need for this part
    Sample study: one group got 7 glasses of water and the other group got 8 glasses of water. The diet was the same as both groups eat the same food and did the same workout and no changes in muscles between the two groups was noted.
    Therefore water is useless and shouldn't be drunk anymore.
    Do you understand?
    I love women. That's why I'm married and my steady girlfriend lives with me. I've quit my players ways. Love is the most powerful force in the Universe. Use the power by clicking on the Rep icon.

    Comment


    • #3
      Bwahaha!

      On your single handed crusade against glutamine, again? All the paper studies in the world are as worthless as last week's lunch when they fly against real world results. I'm tired of hearing about rat studies and aids patient studies. These are irrelevent and invalid. I, myself notice a great difference in muscle recovery using large doses of glutamine. And please don't cry placebo; It's what you're best at when proven wrong. Most experts except Oxford and Harvard prencil-neck computer geeks tend to disagree....

      This information comes direct from Milos Sarcev's message boards, which he recently created.

      The question posted on the boards went like this:

      I have noticed that most of professional bodybuilders claim that they regularly use glutamine. What is so special about this nonessential amino acid? After all body can synthesize glutamine (if there is a need) from other amino acids.

      As we all know, Milos is a bodybuilding genius. There's nothing that he doesn't know about nutrition, supplements, or exercising.

      Anyway, here's HIS answer to the question:

      "Glutamine is unambiguously one of the most popular supplements among the
      bodybuilders and competitive athletes. Just to name a few benefits -glutamine has anabolic activity (increase synthesis of muscle protein), anticatabolic activity (decrease muscle protein breakdown), lipolytic activity (as it increases secretion of "fat burning" growth hormone), increases synthesis of glycogen and ATP, decreases buildup of fatigue substances -lactate and ammonia, boost immune system and free testosterone levels.

      Glutamine is the most abundant amino acid in our body and our muscle tissue. High intensity weight training and any other highly stressful condition depletes Glutamine stores and increases the need for the Glutamine production. Unfortunately even though our body can synthesize this amino acid from the other amino acids (glutamic acid, isoleucin and valine) it appears that body's ability to produce Glutamine doesn't replenishes what was lost during intense training or stress. Many athletes have used it and most commonly they have noticed increased ability to recover from their workouts. Bodybuilders especially can attest for many of glutamine's powerful muscle building and cell volumazing effects.

      I would suggest you to give Glutamine honest try. Don't use it sporadically but make a habit to take 5grams a day immediately after the workout. After the first week start increasing the dosage by 2-3grams until you reach at least 20 grams per day (I have athletes that take up to 40 grams a day with great results). Some bodybuilders on their low carbohydrate diets also take excess amount of Glutamine preferring to get glucose from non-carbohydrate source (Glutamine can be converted into glucose by glyconeogenesis process). This is a common practice among the competitive
      bodybuilders and even though it make some sense I believe that Glutamine is to valuable (and expensive) to be wasted and converted into highly available (and extremely inexpensive) simple sugar -glucose. Finally -don't confuse unessential with unimportant. Essential amino acids got that name
      as our body's can not produce them and we have to intake them through food or
      supplements. " -Milos Sarcev

      Comment


      • #4
        Good work YJ, looks like you put a lot of time and effort into that post.

        I don't use glutamine anymore, but when I did, I noticed my muscle soreness wasn't as severe after a workout, but it could have been the placebo effect, not exactly sure. Other that that, I did not notice anything from it.

        It may not help with anything, but it could play a role in helping your body flush out lactic acid buildup possibly? Do the studies mention anything about that?

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by OldWiseGuy
          When you no longer take or get any protein in your diet. Then I will believe you. Until then it's still protein and will be needed to build muscle. Why don't you prove you case and remove all of glutamine from your body and leave a note on your dead body saying that glutamine is worthless.
          Facts are that both groups still got glutamine in their diet. Only one group got some extra glutamine and the other group got some extra sugar which both are needed to build muscle.
          In fact that study you like to quote didn't prove a damm thing.
          no need for this part
          Sample study: one group got 7 glasses of water and the other group got 8 glasses of water. The diet was the same as both groups eat the same food and did the same workout and no changes in muscles between the two groups was noted.
          Therefore water is useless and shouldn't be drunk anymore.
          Do you understand?
          Sorry, I only respond to studies, research and references.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Bwahaha!

            Originally posted by John Benz
            On your single handed crusade against glutamine, again? All the paper studies in the world are as worthless as last week's lunch when they fly against real world results. I'm tired of hearing about rat studies and aids patient studies. These are irrelevent and invalid. I, myself notice a great difference in muscle recovery using large doses of glutamine. And please don't cry placebo; It's what you're best at when proven wrong. Most experts except Oxford and Harvard prencil-neck computer geeks tend to disagree....
            Read my other threads here about glutamine, you'll soon see Im not alone. All these are worthless, and then you ONCE again cite tesotsterone magazine from 1995 as yuor source? Ha, come on man, might as well debate here since once its done, you can delete it.

            This information comes direct from Milos Sarcev's message boards, which he recently created.
            Te question posted on the boards went like this:
            I have noticed that most of professional bodybuilders claim that they regularly use glutamine. What is so special about this nonessential amino acid? After all body can synthesize glutamine (if there is a need) from other amino acids.
            As we all know, Milos is a bodybuilding genius. There's nothing that he doesn't know about nutrition, supplements, or exercising.
            Anyway, here's HIS answer to the question:
            "Glutamine is unambiguously one of the most popular supplements among the
            bodybuilders and competitive athletes. Just to name a few benefits -glutamine has anabolic activity (increase synthesis of muscle protein), anticatabolic activity (decrease muscle protein breakdown), lipolytic activity (as it increases secretion of "fat burning" growth hormone), increases synthesis of glycogen and ATP, decreases buildup of fatigue substances -lactate and ammonia, boost immune system and free testosterone levels.

            Glutamine is the most abundant amino acid in our body and our muscle tissue. High intensity weight training and any other highly stressful condition depletes Glutamine stores and increases the need for the Glutamine production. Unfortunately even though our body can synthesize this amino acid from the other amino acids (glutamic acid, isoleucin and valine) it appears that body's ability to produce Glutamine doesn't replenishes what was lost during intense training or stress. Many athletes have used it and most commonly they have noticed increased ability to recover from their workouts. Bodybuilders especially can attest for many of glutamine's powerful muscle building and cell volumazing effects.

            I would suggest you to give Glutamine honest try. Don't use it sporadically but make a habit to take 5grams a day immediately after the workout. After the first week start increasing the dosage by 2-3grams until you reach at least 20 grams per day (I have athletes that take up to 40 grams a day with great results). Some bodybuilders on their low carbohydrate diets also take excess amount of Glutamine preferring to get glucose from non-carbohydrate source (Glutamine can be converted into glucose by glyconeogenesis process). This is a common practice among the competitive
            bodybuilders and even though it make some sense I believe that Glutamine is to valuable (and expensive) to be wasted and converted into highly available (and extremely inexpensive) simple sugar -glucose. Finally -don't confuse unessential with unimportant. Essential amino acids got that name
            as our body's can not produce them and we have to intake them through food or
            supplements. " -Milos Sarcev
            LoL.... quote some guy off his message board? Where's the references? Or do you take everything this guy says for granted? Ha, very weak, not going to get it done, not to mention you continue to compare all of 'us' to professional bodybuilders, give me some slin, GH, a gram of test and a gram of EQ and see how I grow Im sure the the glutamine plays a huge role, this is weak, the same shit your brought at anabolicminds, the same shit you deleted once you realized you were being laughed at, I refuse to negate the same, boring, worthless articles. Try some studies or at least something with references, not some guys opinion.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by OldWiseGuy
              When you no longer take or get any protein in your diet. Then I will believe you. Until then it's still protein and will be needed to build muscle. Why don't you prove you case and remove all of glutamine from your body and leave a note on your dead body saying that glutamine is worthless.
              Facts are that both groups still got glutamine in their diet. Only one group got some extra glutamine and the other group got some extra sugar which both are needed to build muscle.
              In fact that study you like to quote didn't prove a damm thing.
              no need for this part
              Sample study: one group got 7 glasses of water and the other group got 8 glasses of water. The diet was the same as both groups eat the same food and did the same workout and no changes in muscles between the two groups was noted.
              Therefore water is useless and shouldn't be drunk anymore.
              Do you understand?
              Change your name. Your not even close to being wise. Go do a PubMed seach on glutmine and see what you find. After that continue to be close minded and justify its use just because you just spent money on it. Its just another time when the $ shapes opinion....

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by OldWiseGuy
                When you no longer take or get any protein in your diet. Then I will believe you. Until then it's still protein and will be needed to build muscle. Why don't you prove you case and remove all of glutamine from your body and leave a note on your dead body saying that glutamine is worthless.
                Obviously you don't know how NON-essential amino acids are used. It won't get used unless 60% of your amino pool is gone. Keep posting because its fun picking your posts apart. Its that damn easy.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by The REAL Bobo
                  Change your name. Your not even close to being wise. Go do a PubMed seach on glutmine and see what you find. After that continue to be close minded and justify its use just because you just spent money on it. Its just another time when the $ shapes opinion....
                  I justify its use because I see real world results. I doubt it's placebo effect, as I had no real expectations, and only realized how potent it was when I ran out and experienced increased muscle soreness. This went away as soon as my glutamine supplementation was back on track. Bobo, YOU I respect, but real world results often fly in face of paper studies.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Fair enough. Try something for me John. Next time you run out just throw in another scoop of Whey and see what happens. Since whey is the most abundant source of glutamine out of all the protein types, technically you should see the same results. Just a thought.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      The abundance of more recent scientific studies demystifying and downgrading the benefits of Glutamine has to make you question it’s potential…..

                      “Real world results” are nothing more than wishful thinking and placebo when faced with the barrage of new data and info we currently have on glutamine use.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by The REAL Bobo
                        Fair enough. Try something for me John. Next time you run out just throw in another scoop of Whey and see what happens. Since whey is the most abundant source of glutamine out of all the protein types, technically you should see the same results. Just a thought.
                        Good idea. You may be right; and I will do just that. See, I am not closeminded.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          claiming placebo is a weak retaliation.

                          those of us who have been training for 10 years or so have used alot of supps in this time. saying you want it to work because you spent so much money on it is another weak debate.

                          if that was the case, we'd still be using cybergenics. hell i paid over 100 dollars for that.

                          we'd all still be using vanadyl. never lose the pump. yea right.

                          what 7 years ago when we stacked andro, 19-nor andro and tribulus to raise T levels? that was alot of money. do we still do this?

                          shit, i'd still be on cell tech. that didnt do squat for me. but i want it to work because its so expensive.

                          same for anosten, acetabolan, nortesten, all muscletech junk.

                          if we believe glutamine works, how come we didnt all feel the same about everything else. we'd all be taken all this junk.

                          i said this last summer when this all started. nothing beats real world results.

                          but to totally change pace, i've got to give big props to YJ. getting all this started, you got me digging deep into studies and looking for info. you opened up a whole new experience for me. i love this shit.

                          THANK YOU, MAN
                          Do you know where one builds action, stamina and guts? In the gym under the iron day after day, forever without fail or excuses or grumbling, that’s where. It’s true. I read a study somewhere and that’s what it said, really.

                          There’d be fewer battles, less drugs and less crime and more happy moms and dads if we all lifted weights… let’s face it. In what recent medical journal was I reading that?

                          .....the basics need to be lifted high in this age of retarded new wave info. dave draper

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            To be fair I didn't mean to sound like I was flaming. But protein is still required to build muscle. I was bodybuilding before most of you were born. And I remember when throwing high cal/protein stuff in a blender was the way to go. Then there was roids amino's and a protein powders came on the market. Still more studies don't prove shit. I still remember when LSD caused birth defects and weed caused brain damage. Most studies are done to prove what someone wishes to prove even if it's not true. I just do what works for me and test stuff myself and let effects be my guide.
                            I love women. That's why I'm married and my steady girlfriend lives with me. I've quit my players ways. Love is the most powerful force in the Universe. Use the power by clicking on the Rep icon.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by OldWiseGuy
                              To be fair I didn't mean to sound like I was flaming. But protein is still required to build muscle. I was bodybuilding before most of you were born. And I remember when throwing high cal/protein stuff in a blender was the way to go. Then there was roids amino's and a protein powders came on the market. Still more studies don't prove shit. I still remember when LSD caused birth defects and weed caused brain damage. Most studies are done to prove what someone wishes to prove even if it's not true. I just do what works for me and test stuff myself and let effects be my guide.
                              First off, age has nothing to do with the argument at hand. Secondly, you are correct, protein is needed not an over abundant amino acid. And the last part of this I will touch is.... did you even bother looking at who did the tests? I guess not. These tests are done by universitys, what profit motive do they have in dismissing a supplement? None. Face it man, sorry to be the bearer of bad news....

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