stop already d150...

[daved150]

TweetMajority opposes auto bailout, poll shows


Most blame industry for problems, believe failure won't hurt economy By Jon Cohen and Jennifer Agiesta

updated 2 hours, 47 minutes ago

WASHINGTON - Most Americans continue to oppose a government-backed rescue plan for Detroit's Big Three automakers as majorities blame the industry for its own problems and are unconvinced failure would hurt the economy, according to a new Washington Post-ABC News poll.
Overall, 55 percent of those polled oppose the latest plan that Chrysler, Ford and General Motors executives pitched to Congress last week, on par with public opposition to earlier, pricier efforts. But with 42 percent support, the new request for up to $14 billion in emergency loans has more backers than previous proposals to secure up to $34 billion in loan guarantees.
But as with the earlier bids, those who strongly oppose the measure greatly outnumber those who are strongly supportive.
Opposition to the automaker bailout is fueled by the widespread perception that the companies themselves are responsible for their predicament, not the faltering economy. In the new poll, three-quarters of Americans said Detroit's woes are mainly the fault of its own management decisions, and a sizable majority of those who blame the front office object to government help.
Nor have Detroit's Big Three made significant progress persuading the public that bankruptcy proceedings would deepen the broader economic slowdown. Sixty percent said it would make no difference or would be good for the economy if one or more of the companies were forced to restructure under the protection of bankruptcy laws.

(that 60 percent needs to be drug tested!!!)

Democrats are among the most wary of the economic impact of failure, with 42 percent saying it would hurt the economy. They are more apt to advocate federal aid — 52 percent support it, up from 42 percent support for previous versions of the rescue bill. But they, too, are deeply critical of company managers — 72 percent fault Detroit's strategies, not the overall economy. (idiots...ofcourse it has nothing to do with the fact that you cant get someone with good credit a fukin loan!!! it's ABSOLUTELY the fault of a shyty economy!!)




Republican opposition has grown stronger, with 69 percent now against the bailout, an increase of 12 points since chief executives from General Motors, Chrysler and Ford last appeared on Capitol Hill to plead their case. Half of all Republicans polled now strongly oppose the plan.
(great...i can no longer be a republican...their too fukin stupid for my support)

Overall, independents continue to lean against the plan, with 57 percent opposing it and 41 percent supporting it. (...and...overall, independants are fukin stupid as well...just not as bad)

Regional differences remain sharp.
About six in 10 of those in the South and West are opposed to the bailout, while those in the Northeast and Midwest, home to much of the affected manufacturing base, are split evenly on the idea.
In many cases regional divisions appear to trump partisan sentiment. Among Democrats and Democratic-leaning independents, a 51 percent majority in the South oppose the plan, as do 49 percent of those in the West, while broad majorities of those in the Midwest (56 percent) and the Northeast (61 percent) support the loans.
Union households are no more apt than those without a union member to favor the plan, 44 percent compared with 42 percent. However, the union householders who support the plan are more likely to be strongly behind the bailout.
The poll was conducted by landline and cellphone from Dec. 11 to 14 among a random national sample of 1,003 adults. The results from the full poll have a margin of sampling error of plus or minus 3 percentage points. Error margins for subgroups are larger.


it amazes me that people dont think about the far reaching effects of this. the town of Wixom Mi is the perfect example. 3 years ago it was an AWSOME little town. 70% of all shops were ma and pa shops. cobblestone walk ways, town square with a park and gazzebo, and every weekend you would find countless people roaming the town and checking out various shops. sidewalk festivals. parades...great community.
ford had to close the plant. they merged 2 plants into one in wayne michigan. now...almost all these shops are gone. it's been over 2 years and every other piece of property is bank owned repo for sale or just vacant.
throw a rock into a lake and it causes a ripple felt all around the lake.
throw a meteor into the ocean and it's cause a tsunami felt around the world!!

this, while not quite being as bad as the meteor, very likely, would be closer than the first analogy.

it's almost to the point where i wish all three would fold. take down the vendors. take down the banks, stop the innovation...and give these idiots what they are looking for!! just for an "i told you so"...but...even though most of you dont agree with me, i'd hate to see you in the finacial pain that would be sure to follow.

[Klash]

TweetMost people that aren't up north don't like the unions and would like to see these companies restructure and weaken these ultra progressive unions.

How many plants do you think they would close if they filed bankruptcy?

[angryoldman]

TweetI own GM stock. I'm all for the bailout!!

[daved150]

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Most people that aren't up north don't like the unions and would like to see these companies restructure and weaken these ultra progressive unions.

How many plants do you think they would close if they filed bankruptcy?

first of all, most people that arent up north dont realize the problem is the retiree's!! when they structured this shyt, many moons ago, who'd have thunk these fukers would live this long???!! thats the prob. i dont know ANYONE working at a plant making over 25-27 bucks an hour. (remember, we sell 85% employees purchases only) toyota averages 28.91 an hour!!! they just dont have as many retiree's to provide pension and healthcare for....should they start knocking the old fukers off???!! or...nationalize health care like the japanese subsidize toyota's retiree's health care!!! that'd be better huh?

the number of plant closing will depend on the reaction of the publics buying habbits. if 70% of the people (like the poll sugested i posted in the other thread) stop buying becouse of a bankruptcy, then i'd guess ALL of them will close!! and, if that happens, they will drag down the vendors, which in turn will idle the other plants, very possibly and quite probobal, forcing them into forclosre...the only one's left standing will be those that are subsidized by their home country...obviously not domestics...we piss on them.
on another note...toyota's starting to shut down plants now!!! this thing is DIRECTLY related to the economy and the banking industry's lack of financing...believe it! if they dont free up credit lines soon, we're all fuked. you dont realize how many industry's depend on credit lines for biz. nobody holds any kinda big $ anymore!!!

[Slightly Enhanced]

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...believe it! if they dont free up credit lines soon, we're all fuked. you dont realize how many industry's depend on credit lines for biz. nobody holds any kinda big $ anymore!!!

buddy of mine is getting laid off because his company can't repackage loans.....didn't even realize his biz relied on this type of transaction...

[daved150]

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buddy of mine is getting laid off because his company can't repackage loans.....didn't even realize his biz relied on this type of transaction...

alot of folks dont realize how this is all tied together and will effect them. it's terrible that these banks are aloud to sit on this money and use it for mergers and investment capital. when i was all for the bank bailout, it was becouse they needed to keep the spicot somewhat open. i knew they'd tighten up, but this is bullshyt! people can say all they want about the big3 "mismanagement" and all that other bullshyt...all i heard for weeks was "how come foriegn manufacture can do it"..."it's their own fault...poor management"....yea, well fukin toyota is postponing openning up, and even building, more plants, and they are shuting down some!! they are suspending production at most, if not all, plants...if they are the golden fukin bench mark of the auto industry, what's their management problem??? and thats WITH the help they get from the japenese government!!! but, we'll continue to put the wrong face on our prob's and point fingers in all the wrong directions...
face it...we're idiots, all of us...the whole fukin nation!

[dixiechick]

TweetI work in the floor covering industry and if you take out what Dave wrote and replaced "auto" and with XYZ business it will apply to them as well...

This is all a pissing match now. Everyone is looking to blame someone when we are all to blame. We took out too much credit hoping for the day we made more money instead of living with in our means. This was a snowball that was rolling downhill growing bigger and bigger.

I heard recently that one of the banks used the bailout money to buy a bank in China. If this is true, then they are using the money for everything else but loans.

[daved150]

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I work in the floor covering industry and if you take out what Dave wrote and replaced "auto" and with XYZ business it will apply to them as well...

This is all a pissing match now. Everyone is looking to blame someone when we are all to blame. We took out too much credit hoping for the day we made more money instead of living with in our means. This was a snowball that was rolling downhill growing bigger and bigger.

I heard recently that one of the banks used the bailout money to buy a bank in China. If this is true, then they are using the money for everything else but loans.

thats been my bytch the whole time!!! we bail them out, they sit on the $ and buy and merge with it, and wont approve car loans (or biz loans or anything else)...how is it not friggin related!! it's the primary reason me and boo had to loose the school!! it's related!! but, when the auto industry ask's for some assistance with a bridge loan, they get lambasted...THEN START GIVING LOANS AGAIN FUKERS!!!! they wont loan to gmac and chysler credit, soooo, they cant do more car loans. ask any banker and they'll tell you...if they (the banks, lenders) dont loan money, they die!! they are systematicly squeezing the life out of some of the compitition!!! i swear...i really am loosing my faith in the people of this country...i love this country, but it's going to shyt! it's so disheartning...

[BoobooKitty]

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thats been my bytch the whole time!!! we bail them out, they sit on the $ and buy and merge with it, and wont approve car loans (or biz loans or anything else)...how is it not friggin related!! it's the primary reason me and boo had to loose the school!! it's related!! but, when the auto industry ask's for some assistance with a bridge loan, they get lambasted...THEN START GIVING LOANS AGAIN FUKERS!!!! they wont loan to gmac and chysler credit, soooo, they cant do more car loans. ask any banker and they'll tell you...if they (the banks, lenders) dont loan money, they die!! they are systematicly squeezing the life out of some of the compitition!!! i swear...i really am loosing my faith in the people of this country...i love this country, but it's going to shyt! it's so disheartning...

Let's just move outta the country!!!!

[BIGMOFO]

Tweetdam detroit folks....lol

[daved150]

Tweeti've been telling boo...we got enough members now that we could just go over throw cuba!!! look....i dont even want to run the place once we're in charge. i'll just take a little chunk of beachfront and open my casino!!! c'mon guys...lets just do it. they're week now!!! it's time!