TweetWell, the thing is your enemy already knows, because being in country you communicate with locals, who report everything you do to them.

The first Bush, cut the military to the core, it was the peace dividend, they let go trained officers, closed bases, etc. Then the first Iraq war hit, which was only accomplished by calling up every national guardsman on hand, and going home early. After that win, the demobolization continued, Clinton was following thru on a policy already well in place for 4 years.

This of course was extremely short sighted because a major war breaks out every ten years on average. (just like financial crisis's) That did not happen in the 80's to us, where we participated to any degree, yet, it was going on in Afghan, when the Soviet union went Bankrupt the war stopped, and thus they put in the peace dividend, and u went approximately 12 years and then..............so, from the get go you had 15 years of downsizing.

Which is why Rumsfeld, promised to do it all for 50 billion, because it was a feasible do-able number, and why the fired the army guy who said we needed 500k troops to do it right, and why Powell wasn't too keen on it.

And now we are where we are at. You say you don't have the equipment, which is horrendously sad, yet, again, this is extremely common in protracted wars, any and all wars.

Again my basic premise was that Obama will not allow afghan to bankrupt us, plain and simple, that is the message.

Hate Motivates, gosh i know you hate him, just saying there are always two sides to the street.

9-11 happened on Bushs watch, so that's revisionist history. One more time, Bind Laden declared war on us in 96, Bush was given all the intel when he took office, he brushed it off repeatedly even though it is documented every agency tried to push the point with him, that is all in the 9-11 hearings.

I'm not arguing likes or dislikes, just what I see, and what I know.

Yesterday I thought Obama again proved himself short-sighted, all he needed was a MISSION ACCOMPLISHED BANNER, behind him in Allentown.

They are talking 170 billion in new stimulus, 100 B for more help to states for unemployment and other bs programs, and 70B for infrastructure, which won't build anything new, just keep states somehwat close on maintenance of existing infrastructure.

Here are some sobering facts, 1.5 million people will enter the workforce, ie, graduates over the next 5 years, we have 10-17 million unemployed, take your statistical pick. Based on a 20 year leveraged economy we produced x amount of jobs per month, right now we are back too year 2000 employment levels.

If you know X, you can figure out factually what the future holds and what needs to be done to get unemployment down.

Now, is that a bush legacy or someone else's or all or our problems.

My favorite Bush fact is that while he went wild in war he allowed a 36,000% increase in ear marks,, yeah you read the % correctly.

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Originally Posted by trip

My favorite Bush fact is that while he went wild in war he allowed a 36,000% increase in ear marks,, yeah you read the % correctly.

Trip, please understand that I am not a Bush fan. The last good president (not perfect) imo was Reagan. I am a libertarian, and thus don't believe in big government period. I believe in the most limited form of government imaginable. Bush increased the deficit, there is no doubting that. Additionally, Obama has increased the deficit an insane amount and with no end in sight. I mean, this man doesn't stop. He just allows the Fed to keep creating money out of thin air as if it doesn't have to be paid back. The problem with Obama is that he is an elitist and academic with no real world experience. He has never held a private job in his life.

You claim to only care about the facts, well then you should realize that the recession was caused by a housing boom-bust cycle that was started during the Clinton administration and Barney Franks fat as*. I agree that Bush kept it going too, but both were at fault. The dems wanted everyone to enjoy the American dream thus pressured banks to lower their lone standards. That is it in a nutshell. Go talk to any fair minded economist. Fortunately my brother is free market economics professor, thus I get to engage in these types of conversations with professionals on a regular basis. You sound like an intelligent man though so I believe either you understand this already or will come to realize it if you research it.

The Iraq war...............well, I didn't agree with it. I was sitting in my room in Korea when I heard the news we were going into Iraq and the only thought my friends and I had was WTF for. It shocked us all. It also changed life for us in Korea. Then, I got back from Korea and less than 4 months after arriving home and in the middle of a divorce (due to Korea 1 yr tour) I was sent to Iraq. I didn't mind it though because I knew we were fighting a brutal enemy. Whether I agreed with the War or not, I swore an oath to serve my country. I have seen Iraq make significant changes, and I do believe the Bush admin did a decent job fighting that war. I say decent because there is too much BS with the way we fight. We can not shoot at an enemy until they shoot at us first. Try to put yourself in that situation. You have surveillance of a guy setting up mortar tubes and preparing to shoot at the compound, but you have to wait until he shoots and not sound an alarm, meaning someone may get killed, and then after he has fired the mortars or rockets you can shoot back. It is pathetic the way we fight wars. Either go all in or get all out.

After my next trip to Iraq or Afghanistan I will give you an update on my opinion of Obama's war strategy. Also, don't believe that pulling troops out that Obama claimed to do. I do not believe for a minute that will happen, just like I knew Guantanamo Bay would not be closed down in 1 year.

My main point is that all politicians are pathetic egotistical, power seeking, elitist, pathological liars. They do not care about me or you or anyone else on this planet other than their own families perhaps. Democrats and Republicans are after the same thing, which is bigger government. Yet if I had to choose between Obama and Bush the decision is an easy one. I would take Bush any day over Obama. I think Obama is another Jimmy Carter, even worse. People say give him a chance, I say he has already blown his chance. He has proved in less than a year that he is a radical with no concern of the private sector. He does not understand the simple solution to a recession, which is leave it alone, the market will correct itself. It was government involvement and the Fed that created this recessions so why should we think the government will get us out. They practice Keynesian economics which is a proven failure. They need to go study the Ludwig von Mises institute and take a lesson in Austrian economics.

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My favorite Bush fact is that while he went wild in war he allowed a 36,000% increase in ear marks,, yeah you read the % correctly.

and didnt the democratic control congerss pass those ear marks while they had congress, yes

TweetWell, I just want to throw my opinion in, and I emphasize that it is my opinion. Both parties are virtually the same nowadays, they don't care about the country per se, they care about staying in office and keeping their party in control. Both parties have been guilty of the destruction of this country. We've been on a path of self destruction for decades now, and it's only getting worse. And until we reign in spending, it doesn't matter who is in control. No military is going to take over our nation, all they have to do is wait for our economy to collapse, and that is more than just what party is in control. The government is too big and too expensive, and with the banks and the fed running things we're doomed. Now I'm not going to entertain anything about "Well Obama is making it worse!" dem this, liberal that. We all know he's making it worse, and maybe he thinks he's doing the right things, which clearly he's not. Maybe he's trying, who knows? But like I said, it's not a difference in the two parties because they are both equally to blame, and neither one is going to just come in and fix things. It's taken decades to cause our problems, and it will take decades to fix them. What we need is strong economic conservatism and freedoms, a good strong free market and less government bureaucracy and intervention. Also we need a good non interventionist foreign policy and more diplomacy. Whatever, I'm kind of rambling now and completely forgot what my point was.

TweetI'll say this yes the republicans blew it when they had the chance to make it better back then but you can bet your ass that when the republicans get back in conrol they will not blow it again and will turn this country around for the better and that will be a fact

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Originally Posted by straydoglogic

Well, I just want to throw my opinion in, and I emphasize that it is my opinion. Both parties are virtually the same nowadays, they don't care about the country per se, they care about staying in office and keeping their party in control. Both parties have been guilty of the destruction of this country. We've been on a path of self destruction for decades now, and it's only getting worse. And until we reign in spending, it doesn't matter who is in control. No military is going to take over our nation, all they have to do is wait for our economy to collapse, and that is more than just what party is in control. The government is too big and too expensive, and with the banks and the fed running things we're doomed. Now I'm not going to entertain anything about "Well Obama is making it worse!" dem this, liberal that. We all know he's making it worse, and maybe he thinks he's doing the right things, which clearly he's not. Maybe he's trying, who knows? But like I said, it's not a difference in the two parties because they are both equally to blame, and neither one is going to just come in and fix things. It's taken decades to cause our problems, and it will take decades to fix them. What we need is strong economic conservatism and freedoms, a good strong free market and less government bureaucracy and intervention. Also we need a good non interventionist foreign policy and more diplomacy. Whatever, I'm kind of rambling now and completely forgot what my point was.

Wow that was well said! You are exactly right.......in my opinion of course, which I believe to be a fact.

Tweetgee trip,
maybe you could be president...have you ever been a chicago community organizer and generally good-buddy of America haters?

Hey, trip
how do you feel about obamacare?

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Originally Posted by straydoglogic

Well, I just want to throw my opinion in, and I emphasize that it is my opinion. Both parties are virtually the same nowadays, they don't care about the country per se, they care about staying in office and keeping their party in control. Both parties have been guilty of the destruction of this country. We've been on a path of self destruction for decades now, and it's only getting worse. And until we reign in spending, it doesn't matter who is in control. No military is going to take over our nation, all they have to do is wait for our economy to collapse, and that is more than just what party is in control. The government is too big and too expensive, and with the banks and the fed running things we're doomed. Now I'm not going to entertain anything about "Well Obama is making it worse!" dem this, liberal that. We all know he's making it worse, and maybe he thinks he's doing the right things, which clearly he's not. Maybe he's trying, who knows? But like I said, it's not a difference in the two parties because they are both equally to blame, and neither one is going to just come in and fix things. It's taken decades to cause our problems, and it will take decades to fix them. What we need is strong economic conservatism and freedoms, a good strong free market and less government bureaucracy and intervention. Also we need a good non interventionist foreign policy and more diplomacy. Whatever, I'm kind of rambling now and completely forgot what my point was.

YEAH ITS BEEN LIKE THAT BUT NOT ANYMORE AS SOON AS THE REPUBLICANS START GETTING THE MAJORITY BACK AND GET A REPUBLICAN PRESIDENT AGAIN WE WILL TURN THIS COUNTRY AROUND WE WILL NOT MAKE THE MISTAKE WE MADE YEARS AGO.THE REPUBLOCANS SCREWD THEMSELVES BUT WONT DO IT ANYMORE NOT AFTER THIS SCUM BAG PRESIDENT